03-02-2013, 11:22 PM
#1
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I never understood how much different shaving with soft water could be. Martin de Candre was always slick and wonderful, but with soft water it lathered so much easier (if you could believe that) and after the final face rinse it was like I couldn't wash the slickness off my face! All I can say is this, If you were thinking about getting a softener besides the normal reasons your shave enjoyment will at least double. Can't wait to see how one of my other favorites (Proraso) improves from the new water. AMAZING! Aaaaa

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 03-02-2013, 11:26 PM
#2
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Yup!

Whenever I travel to an area with hard water, not frequently BTW, I'm reminded of how much I enjoy my soft water.

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 03-02-2013, 11:27 PM
#3
  • tgutc
  • Senior Member
  • Michigan
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Congrats on the softener. I've never had one but plan on getting one this summer. I look forward to my first shave with a softener.

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 03-03-2013, 05:21 AM
#4
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What softener did you go with?

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 03-03-2013, 01:36 PM
#5
  • MaxP
  • Senior Member
  • Madison, WI
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I have a rental softener.

The house I own had a crap GE unit when we moved in. It didn't work correctly and wasn't worth putting any money into. I looked at new units versus renting aunit form a local soft water company.

The rental cost is modest. No service concerns, no cash outlay.

I encourage anyone to investigate rent versus buying/owning.

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 03-03-2013, 01:51 PM
#6
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(03-03-2013, 01:36 PM)MaxP Wrote: I have a rental softener.

The house I own had a crap GE unit when we moved in. It didn't work correctly and wasn't worth putting any money into. I looked at new units versus renting aunit form a local soft water company.

The rental cost is modest. No service concerns, no cash outlay.

I encourage anyone to investigate rent versus buying/owning.

I'm curious...how much are you paying to rent? Does the rental price include the salt? I bought a nice Kenmore water softener about 5 years ago for $400 and installed it myself. The installation was pretty easy and there's been absolutely no issues with it since it went in. I've heard rental prices are around $15/mo so in my case it made much more sense to buy than rent, since payback on the $400 is just over 2 years.

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 03-03-2013, 08:13 PM
#7
  • MaxP
  • Senior Member
  • Madison, WI
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Our cost is $16 a month.

After the poor quality of the GE, I was unwilling to purchase and put in a Lowe's or Sears type unit.
And I had no desire to buy, haul, install, dispose of the old unit, etc

The rental solution resolved all that.

I pay for the salt. Cost is about nine dollares every three months.

This is my experience. Clearly, there are other solutions. If money weren't a factor, I would have purchased a Kinnetico and had it installed.

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 03-04-2013, 10:13 AM
#8
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Patrick, we lucky folks living in Vancouver with our extremely soft water are very fortunate indeed. Congratulations on the new discovery!

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 03-04-2013, 10:34 AM
#9
  • Johnny
  • Super Moderator
  • Wausau, Wisconsin, USA
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I don't want to hijack this thread but just to be sure I'm on the same page with everyone else I need to clarify something.

Forget about shaving for a minute and think about the shower or the bath.

When rinsing the soap off of your body does hard water make it seem hard to rinse, like your leaving a slick film of soap on the skin, and soft water rinses off squeaky clean?

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 03-04-2013, 11:14 AM
#10
  • MaxP
  • Senior Member
  • Madison, WI
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(03-04-2013, 10:34 AM)Johnny Wrote: I don't want to hijack this thread but just to be sure I'm on the same page with everyone else I need to clarify something.

Forget about shaving for a minute and think about the shower or the bath.

When rinsing the soap off of your body does hard water make it seem hard to rinse, like your leaving a slick film of soap on the skin, and soft water rinses off squeaky clean?


Good point. The difference in the shower is VERY distinct. I wouldn't say that soft water rinses 'squeaky clean' though. It's got a bit of slickness to it.

When we travel to a hotel that lacks soft water, the wifemate immediately identifies the presence of lack of soft water. Shampooing her hair without soft water is NOT something she cares for!

Side benefit to soft water is no spotting on the faucets, shower glass, tile, etc.

At sixteen bucks a month, there's no way I'd be without.



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 03-04-2013, 11:39 AM
#11
  • bjorney
  • Senior Member
  • Los Angeles
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The funny thing is that it "feels" like you didn't get the soap off, but you actually do. If you soap up both hands and rinse one in hard and one in soft water, the soft water hand feels slick, but if you lick it, you can taste the soap residue on the hard-water hand, but not the soft... I don't know why it feels slippery, but it actually rinses more completely.

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 03-04-2013, 12:14 PM
#12
  • Songwind
  • Soap Slinger & Scuttle Pusher
  • Burnsville, MN
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I have been getting soap scum and deposits, even with my water softener.

Looking into my city's web pages, it looks like I have my softener set about 28% too low. Tongue

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 03-04-2013, 12:45 PM
#13
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ah - this thread is very interesting. i believe i got hard water to the extreme - and i unfortunately see it everyday on the results from my (dish)washing machines. i'm sure hard water also explains my at times struggle with the shaving soaps. the only plus must be that the water is very tasty when cold.

my water comes from a well on my property. should a water softener ideally be mounted as close to the well as possible or will it be good enough to put it in the basement where the main water pipe intake is located?

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 03-04-2013, 01:02 PM
#14
  • Songwind
  • Soap Slinger & Scuttle Pusher
  • Burnsville, MN
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(03-04-2013, 12:45 PM)tonsorius Wrote: ah - this thread is very interesting. i believe i got hard water to the extreme - and i unfortunately see it everyday on the results from my (dish)washing machines. i'm sure hard water also explains my at times struggle with the shaving soaps. the only plus must be that the water is very tasty when cold.

my water comes from a well on my property. should a water softener ideally be mounted as close to the well as possible or will it be good enough to put it in the basement where the main water pipe intake is located?

As far as I know, your water softener just has to be between the water source and the places the water is being used. So in the house should be fine.

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 03-04-2013, 02:17 PM
#15
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Actually there are very good reasons for installing the softener so that it only softens the water where washing happens if that's possible. OK, I'll word it differently. Keep the drinking water line(s) unsoftened if possible.

A water softener works by substituting sodium for the calcium ion. Calcium is good for the body, but makes the water hard. Sodium is only good for the body in relatively small amounts and doesn't contribute to water hardness. So if you're following this, Sodium is OK for washing, not so good for drinking; calcium is good for the body, not so good for washing. Hence, ideally, washing lines get treated and drinking lines are left hard. Easier to do with new construction but expensive.

Especially important for those with high blood pressure since they don't need added sodium in their diet.

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 03-04-2013, 03:55 PM
#16
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thank you very much. so - hard inside - soft outside Biggrin

separate drinking and washing lines sounds like a very good idea and something i will dwell into. my house is fairly large and water pipes goes into nearly every room. as it of course can be little bit tricky to foresee which pipes will be used for drinking - 2-3 dedicated in a house would probably suffice - kitchen probably most important.

although another and somewhat unrelated topic - but i mention it anyway: tea is a big and important part of my life - and my tea supplier insists on soft water for tea and says soft water for tea changes the taste dramatically to the better. why could that be so - since hard water is great when cold?

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 03-04-2013, 06:46 PM
#17
  • tgutc
  • Senior Member
  • Michigan
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I'd never given any thought to that Brian but that makes so much sense. Thank you for sharing your knowledge with us.

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 03-04-2013, 07:48 PM
#18
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I talked to the water softener people and they said there isn't enough salt to warrant any worries about drinking it. My whole house is soft now due to the basement being finished and no access to pipes. I don't like the taste of the soft water so I put a R.O. system under the sink for the fridge and the Ice maker. The Ice cubes aren't white they are crystal clear! It's cool. And the water has no taste at all pure water!

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 03-04-2013, 09:19 PM
#19
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(03-04-2013, 03:55 PM)tonsorius Wrote: separate drinking and washing lines sounds like a very good idea and something i will dwell into. my house is fairly large and water pipes goes into nearly every room. as it of course can be little bit tricky to foresee which pipes will be used for drinking - 2-3 dedicated in a house would probably suffice - kitchen probably most important.

Around these parts, water softeners are very common. You can even buy the salt at the gas station. The one near me has it stacked up right next to the pump! The common practice here is to soften all the water in the house except for the line going to the kitchen sink, the ice maker, and any outdoor faucets.

While I prefer the taste of hard water, the soften water is not intolerable. I have no problems using it for brushing my teeth or for a quick drink in our bathroom.

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 03-04-2013, 10:57 PM
#20
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Well as promised on to the Proraso. Tonight I used the Red tub and my first thought is I need to relearn how to load the brush with the soft water. I had enough lather for 4-5 passes. I have used the Proraso line of soaps more than anything else. It was from a PIF that I received a 90% full tub of original green and loved the smell and the results, the rest is history. I have to say that the soft water has improved the lubrication of the red soap by 50-60% and it isn't nearly as thirsty a soap as it was using hard water. Over all one of my favorites just got way better all the way around. Thumbup

This is going to be fun to see just how much better soaps like Tabac, Mike's, PdP and Klar Kabinett are going to get by just adding soft water. I can see why now people who were having trouble lathering soaps would get advice like "Try some bottled water next time." I'm truly a believer now!

(03-03-2013, 05:21 AM)slowhand Wrote: What softener did you go with?

I went with a Pacific Water Inc. Sentry II from what I have heard through experienced people uses the Clack (Name brand) valves. Supposedly one of if not the best valves out there.

Johnny, here is some info I found on my softener this should help understand a little better.

Sentry II 960 Series Residential Water Softener

The Sentry II 960 Series Residential Water Softeners are suitable for applications up to 60,000 grains of hardness removal capacity at peak flow rates of up to 24 gpm depending on the system selected.

Sentry II Electronic on-demand metered soft watered system

Features
•Saves up to 50% in salt and uses less water by regeneration only when necessary.
•The 1" full port design allows for the highest flow rates available in a 1" and ¾" system.
•The electronic microprocessor keeps track of the amount of water used each day and adjusts itself to match your needs.
•State of the art electronic microprocessor backs up the program memory without the use of a battery.
•Reserve capacity is self-adjusting to ensure a continuous supply of conditioned water.
•Premium quality water softening resin to ensure trouble free operation.
•Reduces the effect of scale build up in your water heater and water piping.
•Extends the life of dishwasher, washing machines, water heaters as well as faucets and other water used appliances.
•Reduces the amount of detergent and soap requirements by up to 70%.
•Clothes washed in conditioned water last longer, colors stay brighter, and come out cleaner and softer.
•Helps control spotting on glasses and tableware.
•Helps reduce skin irritations and adds a healthy luster to hair, leaving it soft and easy to groom.
•Reduces the amount of detergent and soap requirements by up to 70%.
•Reduces the amount of detergent and soap requirements by up to 70%


As for why does you skin still feel slippery when washing the soap off. Here is the answer.

"Q. Why is soft water slippery or slimy feeling in the shower?
A. In the water treatment business we call it "silky". Actually, hard water strips the natural oils from skin while soft water allows these oils to remain. If it seems like the soap won't come off, just rinse off & then towel dry... you will soon find that your skin is wonderfully soft & no soap residue remains. You can expect softer skin and clean, softer hair after switching to soft water."

Hope that helps a little Johnny! Maybe we can get a study done that will tell you how much soft water reduces your shaving soap needs per shave!

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