06-08-2013, 12:59 PM
#1
  • Teiste
  • Moderator Emeritus
  • Salt Lake City,UT
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I have received a couple pm's asking me regarding the C&E shaving soaps , since the new formulations of these soaps arent performing very well.

Ok , let me tell you what I know and have experienced with these soaps.

-The new Sienna and Limes (Sodium Palmate as first ingredient) are worthless.Impossible to make stable lather from them.The new Sienna (once again , Sodium Palmate as first ingredient) smells even sweeter than the old Sienna (Potassium Palmate as first ingredient).

-The Sandalwood on the wooden bowl has Sodium Palmate as first ingredient (and some of the refills) but lathers perfectly well.Skin care wise is ok.There are some Sandalwood refills which contains Potassium Palmate as first ingredient (I bought one on my last trip so So Cal a couple months ago) and performs very well , like the first Geo F Trumper veggie based soaps (from 2008-2009).Excellent skin care and , both formulations , nice sandalwood scent.

-The Nomad and Sienna with Potassium Palmate as first ingredient perform like the Sandalwood with Potassium Palmate and , again , great performers (easy to make thick , stable lather) and good skin care.I havent seen the Nomad with another formulation (I mean , with Sodium Palmate as first ingredient) yet.

So , if youre going to buy a C&E soap , check the ingredients first :

-If they have Sodium Palmate as first ingredient (but the Sandalwood) , stay away from it.

-If they contain Potassium Palmate as first ingredient , good shaving soap.

Hope this info could help you to avoid the new Sienna , which is rubbish , and the Limes.

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 06-08-2013, 01:10 PM
#2
  • Andrew
  • Senior Member
  • Austin, TX
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How I'm going to remember this:

If the first letter of the first ingredient is an S, it sucks.

If the first letter of the first ingredient is a P, it's perfect.

Thanks Teiste.

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 06-08-2013, 01:14 PM
#3
  • Teiste
  • Moderator Emeritus
  • Salt Lake City,UT
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(06-08-2013, 01:10 PM)Andrew Wrote: How I'm going to remember this:

If the first letter of the first ingredient is an S, it sucks.

If the first letter of the first ingredient is a P, it's perfect.

Thanks Teiste.

242424Laughing1Sisi1

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 06-08-2013, 01:54 PM
#4
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Based on my experience with C&E soaps, in the past they were very identical in performance to Trumpers, which made me think they were made by the same people. With that being said, its not really surprising the new reformulations suck, but I have no actual facts, just common sense.

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 06-08-2013, 01:58 PM
#5
  • Grumpy
  • Senior Member
  • DisneyLand
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I will have to see what C&E Soap I had gifted to me.

Hopefully, it is a "P".

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 06-08-2013, 02:35 PM
#6
  • Teiste
  • Moderator Emeritus
  • Salt Lake City,UT
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(06-08-2013, 01:54 PM)Sodapopjones Wrote: Based on my experience with C&E soaps, in the past they were very identical in performance to Trumpers, which made me think they were made by the same people. With that being said, its not really surprising the new reformulations suck, but I have no actual facts, just common sense.

For what I known too , there were made in the same factory in Leicestershire than the Trumper and Penhaligons soaps...

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 06-08-2013, 03:05 PM
#7
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Have only the old of the C&E. Guess I'm lucky(:-/)!

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 06-08-2013, 04:27 PM
#8
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When did this reformulation take place? I bought a Nomad last year that lathered very well and recently acquired a new Sienna in trade that does as well. The Sienna did not come with a box so I don't know what the ingredients are.

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 06-08-2013, 10:15 PM
#9
  • Teiste
  • Moderator Emeritus
  • Salt Lake City,UT
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(06-08-2013, 04:27 PM)guildx500 Wrote: When did this reformulation take place? I bought a Nomad last year that lathered very well and recently acquired a new Sienna in trade that does as well. The Sienna did not come with a box so I don't know what the ingredients are.

By sept last year (for what I remember) , the Limes and new Sienna were introduced on the market.

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 06-08-2013, 10:51 PM
#10
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(06-08-2013, 02:35 PM)Teiste Wrote:
(06-08-2013, 01:54 PM)Sodapopjones Wrote: Based on my experience with C&E soaps, in the past they were very identical in performance to Trumpers, which made me think they were made by the same people. With that being said, its not really surprising the new reformulations suck, but I have no actual facts, just common sense.

For what I known too , there were made in the same factory in Leicestershire than the Trumper and Penhaligons soaps...

That makes sense, actually a lot of sense, it all started with Pens. I wonder if it was the actual manufacturer that caused the reformulations, or if the other British firms followed suit. Wasn't TOBS reformulated as well?

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 06-09-2013, 05:08 PM
#11
  • Teiste
  • Moderator Emeritus
  • Salt Lake City,UT
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(06-08-2013, 10:51 PM)Sodapopjones Wrote:
(06-08-2013, 02:35 PM)Teiste Wrote:
(06-08-2013, 01:54 PM)Sodapopjones Wrote: Based on my experience with C&E soaps, in the past they were very identical in performance to Trumpers, which made me think they were made by the same people. With that being said, its not really surprising the new reformulations suck, but I have no actual facts, just common sense.

For what I known too , there were made in the same factory in Leicestershire than the Trumper and Penhaligons soaps...



That makes sense, actually a lot of sense, it all started with Pens. I wonder if it was the actual manufacturer that caused the reformulations, or if the other British firms followed suit. Wasn't TOBS reformulated as well?

Well , it seems that Floris and the Taylor of Old Bond Street soaps are made by the same company too, and seems to be based in Leicestershire too.

I used to lived in Leicester and Peterborough back in 2000 , and never had the chance to visit any of those shaving soap factories , either Creightons (Peterborough).

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 06-09-2013, 05:13 PM
#12
  • tsimmns
  • Senior Member
  • Mississippi
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Your reviews on soaps and brushes is always appreciated Testie.

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 06-09-2013, 05:35 PM
#13
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What a weird thing to do amongst soaps that most would think are the same except for scent. I think someone may have made a very large mistake. If the English soaps weren't reforms laying themselves out of the game then is say it was a mistake for sure. As is this could just be them using up the old base & moving to the new not-so-improved new base.

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 06-09-2013, 06:47 PM
#14
  • tsimmns
  • Senior Member
  • Mississippi
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(06-09-2013, 05:35 PM)SharpSpine Wrote: What a weird thing to do amongst soaps that most would think are the same except for scent. I think someone may have made a very large mistake. If the English soaps weren't reforms laying themselves out of the game then is say it was a mistake for sure. As is this could just be them using up the old base & moving to the new not-so-improved new base.

I wish someone would write all the companies that have removed tallow from their soaps, making a comparison of each soap before and after the switch from tallow and ask them exactly what they were thinking. I have marked soaps off my list to try that no longer have tallow in them after the reviews. It just seems someone in these companies dropped a ball somewhere that might cost them in the long run.

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 06-09-2013, 06:50 PM
#15
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FWIW, tallow is NOT a magical ingredient. In face I prefer non-tallow soaps for the most part. It's all about formulations and a lot of the new formulations flat out stink; tallow or not. Remember that modern Williams is still a tallow soap. Shok

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 06-09-2013, 06:59 PM
#16
  • tsimmns
  • Senior Member
  • Mississippi
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What exactly does the tallow do? Provide better protection, glide, moisturizing for the skin? I personally find Mike's, Arko, and Cella to work best on my face. Is there any resemblance in these soaps with the ingredients?

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 06-09-2013, 08:54 PM
#17
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(06-09-2013, 05:08 PM)Teiste Wrote:
(06-08-2013, 10:51 PM)Sodapopjones Wrote:
(06-08-2013, 02:35 PM)Teiste Wrote: For what I known too , there were made in the same factory in Leicestershire than the Trumper and Penhaligons soaps...



That makes sense, actually a lot of sense, it all started with Pens. I wonder if it was the actual manufacturer that caused the reformulations, or if the other British firms followed suit. Wasn't TOBS reformulated as well?

Well , it seems that Floris and the Taylor of Old Bond Street soaps are made by the same company too, and seems to be based in Leicestershire too.

I used to lived in Leicester and Peterborough back in 2000 , and never had the chance to visit any of those shaving soap factories , either Creightons (Peterborough).

(06-09-2013, 05:35 PM)SharpSpine Wrote: What a weird thing to do amongst soaps that most would think are the same except for scent. I think someone may have made a very large mistake. If the English soaps weren't reforms laying themselves out of the game then is say it was a mistake for sure. As is this could just be them using up the old base & moving to the new not-so-improved new base.
Getting the British to own up to anything is impossible, that's why Mark is a godsend, lol. They probably reformulated to make a quick buck, but in the end, are doing more harm then good. I just wish I knew who's idea it was.
(06-09-2013, 06:59 PM)tsimmns Wrote: What exactly does the tallow do? Provide better protection, glide, moisturizing for the skin? I personally find Mike's, Arko, and Cella to work best on my face. Is there any resemblance in these soaps with the ingredients?

The best example I can give you is to try one of the RazoRock LOA soaps, and then buy the RazoRock LOA *Muget de France* the same soap, but it does not contain tallow, otherwise the base if virtually the same. I can guarantee you wont notice much of a difference, or non at all if you didn't read the labels. The actual soap base is whats important, not the mere addition of tallow. One last example, non tallow soaps are stigma'ed as lacking cushion and aren't quite as rich, however pickup a puck of Osma. It produces the thickest richest lather I have ever seen, but due to the alum in it, it's not as slick as it should be.

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 06-10-2013, 04:39 AM
#18
  • turtle
  • Member
  • Lost in the lather
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I just dug though my drawer of "stashed" soaps and all of my C&E products are the older type. Man I should not have done that. I never realized how much "stuff" I have stashed away. Scary. Four drawers full and to think I was contemplating getting some artisan soaps (Mikes and/or Prairie Creations). WOW... What am I going to do now Sad

On the bright side I did finish a tube of TOBS sandalwood cream, On the doh side I just found out I have 3 more tubes and 2 tubs of sandalwood cream on top of the 2 I still have open in the shave den [Image: SJaIKsj.gif]

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 06-10-2013, 08:21 AM
#19
  • oscar11
  • Senior Member
  • North Dakota
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That's too bad, I always liked this soap.

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 06-10-2013, 09:01 AM
#20
  • TRBeck
  • Unregistered
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My first good soap was C&E Sandalwood. Still like the scent, but the most recent puck I tried was a joke. I agree with Brian that tallow isn't the magical ingredient. It's just poor reformulation of products, and I do wish Trumper and C&E would switch back to the good veggie formula (or tallow if it would be better still). Too bad.

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