04-17-2012, 05:22 PM
#1
  • bullgoose
  • The Enabler
  • Redondo Beach, California, U.S.A
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I think we all need to respond to this blog. According to the author, we must be below the social pinnacle because we use double edge razors. Tongue

http://blogs.hbr.org/cs/2012/04/how_pg_i...-499179141

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 04-17-2012, 05:39 PM
#2
  • Songwind
  • Soap Slinger & Scuttle Pusher
  • Burnsville, MN
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I am certainly below the social pinnacle, I don't know about you. Smile

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 04-17-2012, 06:15 PM
#3
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The internet will break barriers,they're using those DE entry level razors over in India right now and same thing with Motorcycles,Harley Davidson's entry level bike the Sportster has become popular in India,so much so that Harley Davidson is opening a Factory right in India so they can ship the parts over and assemble the motorcycles there so import tarrifs don't make prices unrealistic for buyers.

I suspect over time there will be a demand for other more expensive Harley Davidsons,and if as the word spreads next thing ya know they'll be a demand for Gillette Super Speeds...Vintage Gillettes going to affluent Indians who are too savy to listen to any of that 5 bladed Fusion propaganda Cool

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 04-17-2012, 06:20 PM
#4
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He calls himself a journalist! He has not even researched his facts properly!

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 04-17-2012, 06:22 PM
#5
  • bullgoose
  • The Enabler
  • Redondo Beach, California, U.S.A
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(04-17-2012, 06:20 PM)celestino Wrote: He calls himself a journalist! He has not even researched his facts properly!

No kidding. When Michael Ham pointed this out, the journalist became defensive and snarky.

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 04-17-2012, 06:34 PM
#6
  • TexBilly
  • Moderator Emeritus
  • Austin, TX
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(04-17-2012, 06:22 PM)bullgoose Wrote:
(04-17-2012, 06:20 PM)celestino Wrote: He calls himself a journalist! He has not even researched his facts properly!

No kidding. When Michael Ham pointed this out, the journalist became defensive and snarky.

As they do...just pathetic. Gives me more resolve!

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 04-17-2012, 06:46 PM
#7
  • Johnny
  • Super Moderator
  • Wausau, Wisconsin, USA
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Phil, I think you and Michael said all that needs to be said on that blog. To bad neither of you got through to him.

Duh!Eyepop

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 04-17-2012, 07:00 PM
#8
  • freddy
  • Senior Member
  • San Diego, California, U.S.A.
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Gentlemen, what this man is doing is discussing the clever business model used by Gillette and probably couldn't give a rat's tuchis about the finer points of shaving. He is, after all, a professor of international business at Dartmouth and this article showed up in The Harvard Business Review, not The Shave Nook, TSD, DFS, SRP, B&B or any other shave centric site.

Where I do agree with Phil is the snarky answer he gave Michael. It was totally uncalled for and, ultimately, undermines the validity of what he is writing about which is a successful business model (no matter how much we may hate that model) and not the fine art of shaving.

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 04-17-2012, 08:14 PM
#9
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Honestly... with the great shaves I'm enjoying I couldn't care less about where the so called "social pinnacle" is - or what it is Biggrin

That said, the snarky, defensive response he gave - along with several like it - pretty much kills any believability in the actual article. After all; if he can't stand being corrected on facts, how can we trust the facts and analysis he did in the brief article?

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 04-17-2012, 10:12 PM
#10
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I think that article was more the author and a sidekick shilling his book than about shaving.

If Indian men are frequently cutting themselves while shaving, then maybe it is technique. Maybe it is time to translate Leisureguy's Guide to Gourmet Shaving into Hindi and other Indian languages. Why would they be cutting themselves and we are not? I tend to believe that they don't.

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 04-17-2012, 10:52 PM
#11
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I had the joy of working closely with a company of Bangladeshi soldiers in South Sudan last year. The rank and file - who were paid little more than a pittance - shaved with DE razors and what looked to me to be normal hand soap. The officers - who were great guys and also paid little more than a pittance - used "modern" razors and canned foam*. Guess who of them usually had the better shave?

I can't make myself believe that there is much difference between the average Indian and the average Bangladeshi - they are neighbors, after all. I think the main issue, and the main reason why the men of the sub-continent is switching to cartridge razors, is the perceived increase in social standing. "The movie star is using this razor; if I use it I will be as successful as he is.". I guess in a way it's a cargo-cult thing - in many ways similiar to how the locals in 'my' corner of South Sudan treated cellphones ("Successful businessmen have cellphones. I must therefore get a cellphone to become / appear as a successful businessmen - never mind that the closest tower is half a day away.")

Can the average Indian get a better, cheaper shave with a DE razor than with the cartridge razor, possible requiring a little training? Off course.
Will using a DE razor be perceived as being upscale and socially successful? Off course not.

*) Except one of the majors - he had his bat man shave him with lather and a straight razor. Was a sight to see while on Long Duration Patrol; deep in the bush, sitting outside his tent and getting a shave while sipping tea.

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 04-18-2012, 04:12 AM
#12
  • Howler
  • A calamophile and vintage razor lover
  • Fort Smith AR
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I agree with all the comments made here already.

I love to to shave traditionally, if that makes abnormal and below the social pinnacle bravo. I have rediscovered how to have a great shave every morning.

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 04-18-2012, 04:39 AM
#13
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None of my business what other people think of me.

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 04-18-2012, 04:46 AM
#14
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(04-17-2012, 10:52 PM)WegianWarrior Wrote: I had the joy of working closely with a company of Bangladeshi soldiers in South Sudan last year. The rank and file - who were paid little more than a pittance - shaved with DE razors and what looked to me to be normal hand soap. The officers - who were great guys and also paid little more than a pittance - used "modern" razors and canned foam*. Guess who of them usually had the better shave?

I can't make myself believe that there is much difference between the average Indian and the average Bangladeshi - they are neighbors, after all. I think the main issue, and the main reason why the men of the sub-continent is switching to cartridge razors, is the perceived increase in social standing. "The movie star is using this razor; if I use it I will be as successful as he is.". I guess in a way it's a cargo-cult thing - in many ways similiar to how the locals in 'my' corner of South Sudan treated cellphones ("Successful businessmen have cellphones. I must therefore get a cellphone to become / appear as a successful businessmen - never mind that the closest tower is half a day away.")

Can the average Indian get a better, cheaper shave with a DE razor than with the cartridge razor, possible requiring a little training? Off course.
Will using a DE razor be perceived as being upscale and socially successful? Off course not.

*) Except one of the majors - he had his bat man shave him with lather and a straight razor. Was a sight to see while on Long Duration Patrol; deep in the bush, sitting outside his tent and getting a shave while sipping tea.

Excellent post!

Really like much positioning of western companies in the developing world, they are offering a means of social climbing to a population that historically has felt left out of much of the perceived luxury of the modern world.

I enjoyed your story of about serving with Bangladeshi soldiers in South Sudan - very interesting.

The Dartmouth professor who posted on the HBR blog simply is a apologists for the process where corporations convince buyers to accept poorer quality products and convince those buyers that they are getting better products.

The fact that his shaving experience never touched DE's and took him to believe that the Fusion Pro Glide is the pinnacle of shaving shows that he's not particularly inquisitive or opened-minded. There's a difference between scholarship and being a mouthpiece.

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 04-19-2012, 01:14 PM
#15
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*lol* this fellow has been assimilated and is now part of the P&G collective. Look out India resistance is futile!

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 04-19-2012, 01:45 PM
#16
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I did not see the gentleman as snarky or biased. He was discussing marketing.

As afi's we have to realize the majority of men could give a crap about shaving. It is a chore to them and anything that will give good results with less thought and time the better. Marketing helps enhance and widen that perception. That is why the majority of the population switched in the 70's.

Trying to convince someone over the internet about why they should DE shave, when method and material was not even the point of the article, seems like a waste of breath.

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 04-19-2012, 03:17 PM
#17
  • tgutc
  • Senior Member
  • Michigan
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He did try to make a point that DE shaving was inferior to the Fusion or Mach 3. The author said it produces far more nicks and cuts and even called DE shaving below the social pinnacle. I do not need to explain to every one on this forum how VERY laughable that is. The point wasn't to convince him to DE shave, it was to hold him accountable for publishing an article that had unfactual information. It worked too because if you read the comments he does admit to knowing absolutely nothing about DE shaving.

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 04-19-2012, 03:56 PM
#18
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(04-19-2012, 03:17 PM)tgutc Wrote: He did try to make a point that DE shaving was inferior to the Fusion or Mach 3. The author said it produces far more nicks and cuts and even called DE shaving below the social pinnacle. I do not need to explain to every one on this forum how VERY laughable that is.

Here it may be laughable but in India it may be fact. There is some truths to what they based their marketing and product development on. They now hold a % 50 market share.

The point I was making is the article was about marketing and not about the superiority of one type of shaving. We interpreted as a slight and argued for points he was not refuting or even discussing

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 04-19-2012, 04:31 PM
#19
  • Johnny
  • Super Moderator
  • Wausau, Wisconsin, USA
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(04-19-2012, 03:56 PM)SteelTown Wrote:
(04-19-2012, 03:17 PM)tgutc Wrote: He did try to make a point that DE shaving was inferior to the Fusion or Mach 3. The author said it produces far more nicks and cuts and even called DE shaving below the social pinnacle. I do not need to explain to every one on this forum how VERY laughable that is.

Here it may be laughable but in India it may be fact. There is some truths to what they based their marketing and product development on. They now hold a % 50 market share.

The point I was making is the article was about marketing and not about the superiority of one type of shaving. We interpreted as a slight and argued for points he was not refuting or even discussing

Oh Dan, you're no fun.Biggrin

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 04-19-2012, 05:11 PM
#20
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(04-19-2012, 04:31 PM)Johnny Wrote: Oh Dan, you're no fun.Biggrin

You must have talked to my wife Biggrin

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