08-20-2014, 11:49 PM
#1
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Can anyone tell me the knot size in mm and the loft in mm on the size 12 and size 14 HMW Plisson brush ?

I'm contemplating getting either a size 12 or a size 14 for Christmas this year Cool

I'm a face lather, prefer rather dense brushes and preferably with lower loft - but think I still can and will enjoy a luxurious Plisson HMW knot if bought in the correct size for my preferences.

Since I can't test it out, I have to ask Plisson owners for help and guidance.

I never bowl lather - like never ever !!

I use creams, croaps, soaps - and super lather them almost all the time. I prefer knot sizes from 24 mm and up to 29 mm.
I enjoy 2-band badgers as well as some 3-band badger, but dislike a floppy soft brush like a Thäter 2-band in a less dense fan shaped knot. I enjoy a Thäter 2-band in a bulb shaped knot with a size 26 mm knot and up.

I don't necessarily only prefer the ÜBER dense and rough 2-band brushes, but can still appreciate the luxury of a soft cloud like brush as long as it still has a good level of backbone to it

In fact I'm slowly moving away from the rough scrubby 2-band brushes now.......

I do still own a brush like the Davinchi, but it's for sale now but I have to say this is a 3-band Silvertip badger brush with a rather high loft that I actually enjoy for face lathering.
But it's not among my top favorites, and since I own 50+ brushes, I cut out the less than perfect brushes in my brush collection and sell them.

Would a plisson Size 12 or size 14 in HMW badger hair suit me ?

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 08-21-2014, 03:11 AM
#2
  • TheMonk
  • Super Moderator
  • Porto, Portugal
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Both the size 12 and 14 have the same knot diameter, 22mm. Only the loft is different, being 56mm on the #12 and 59mm on the #14.

I had the same exact doubt as you have some time ago, and was advised to either go for a #12 or #16, because #14 would essentially be a floppier version of the #12.

I'm a bowl latherer, so I went for the #16, but considering you are a face latherer, I'd most likely go for a #12.

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 08-21-2014, 04:35 AM
#3
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Once loaded with cream my 12 feels plump on the face. I wouldn't want it any bigger. Feels just right in my book!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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 08-21-2014, 05:28 AM
#4
  • refles
  • Senior Member
  • New York
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Even with HWM's longer lofts, the individual hairs I found to be thick. Something similar to Manchurian as those hairs are thicker than say Super/Fine. I think the lofts on the Plissons are deceiving because as BossShave mentions its plumps up after loaded with lather but the brush is very far from floppy, you can actually execute circular scrubbing motions with it and it will generally retain its shape. I think it retains heat fairly well as well as flow through. Very different feel from Manchurian thou... different experience all together.

I was thinking to get a size 14, but I'm very happy with my Size 12 2 band HMW in horn as any longer loft I'm not sure if I would like it.

I was able to locate this chart.. (a bit of an eye chart)
[Image: zsZroYJ.jpg]

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 08-21-2014, 08:09 AM
#5
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Claus, this is very much a YMMV, and reading your comments on likes and dislikes. And from your brush inventory.

I don't think a Plisson 12 / 14/ 16 HMW will suit you, I own and love both my Horn handles 14 /16 HMW, due to Plisson having a higher loft IOM I would not recommend one for you as you are a face lather.

Plisson does exhibit backbone, but not I think as you would like it i.e Rooney /M & F, Simpson, sHavemac D01.

Plisson HMW & Simpson Manchurian are very very similar, BUT not the same.

After all this talk Claus only you are the only one that can decide either you like one or not.............
Good luck in your quest.


Charles U.K

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 08-21-2014, 09:07 PM
#6
  • grantmm
  • Friend of the Badgers
  • Draper, Utah
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I'm going to have to side with Charles. If you're looking for a super soft brush with some backbone, the HMW isn't going to be it. My 2 Plisson HMW 12s (2 band and 3 band) have Jekyll & Hyde characteristics. Some shaves they feel very soft and other shaves I get prickly contact. But they always have a good bit of splay during use. It doesn't take a whole lot of pressure to get them to splay heavily.

I love them, but they aren't my go to brush based on my preferences.

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 08-22-2014, 01:03 AM
#7
  • ben74
  • Senior Member
  • Perth, Australia
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Claus, think Simspon Manchurian, then subtract half the density and then double the loft...

If that still sounds appealing, then you are in for a treat with either choice. Plisson deviate from all current brush manufacturers. They are not dense. They are hit and miss regarding softness of tips. They aren't Kent floppy as the hairs are infinitely more robust, but they splay wonderfully. Flow through is supreme and lather production is abundant. I love them, but I'm (currently) in the minority.

The size 14 is the only size I don't have and its next on my list to acquire.

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 08-22-2014, 01:44 AM
#8
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Thanks Gents, I'm very tempted to get the Plisson 12 in genuine horn, but being only 22 mm in knot size and having a loft of 56, I'm not sure it will be the dream brush for me, and priced at €325 it'd better be darn great.......

Depending on what I get in for the rest of my DE razors - as sson as I can start making sales again on The Nook and my paypal accont is up again - I will determine if buying the Plisson is worth the risk.

I still from time to time actually consider going 110% synthetic, and sell all my badgers - but then change my mind once again.

I think it's just a matter of time before all my badgers are gone and I only use synthetic, perhaps when Plisson makes a 24 mm version of their synthetic and Mühle makes the STF v3........just maybe when this happens, all my badgers will be cleared from my den.....juts like I did with all my DE Razors

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 08-22-2014, 01:49 AM
#9
  • ben74
  • Senior Member
  • Perth, Australia
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(08-22-2014, 01:44 AM)CHSeifert Wrote: ...I'm not sure it will be the dream brush for me...

Signs011

If you like the Plisson synthetic, but wouldn't mind more feedback against the face, then you would most likely enjoy it. However, I tend to agree with your prediction above...

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 08-22-2014, 03:04 AM
#10
  • Andrew
  • Senior Member
  • Austin, TX
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Claus, I think you will continue to wonder about Plisson HMW unless you try one for yourself. I exclusively face lather, and I find the size 12 suits this purpose marvelously. You just have to adopt a different technique - i.e., don't apply as much pressure when using the brush. I would go with the size 12 over the size 14 because of the same knot diameter at a shorter loft and lower price. Do not worry that it will be a small brush. I looked at both size 12 and 16 and felt the 16 was quite a large brush. The size 12 is a very nice middle of the road sized brush.

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 08-27-2014, 10:35 AM
#11
  • Lradke
  • Senior Member
  • Edmonton, Alberta
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Just for the sake not not creating a new thread, I'll ask this here.

What would the difference be between EW and HMW? I have read a few threads on other sites stating there is almost no difference between the two. Is this true?

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 08-27-2014, 11:42 AM
#12
  • kiruiz
  • Boellis Man
  • San Juan PR
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Guys:

I do have a 14. It has the measurements It is very floppy. I used just on creams. No soaps at all.
But its an awesome brush.

thanks
Ken

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 08-27-2014, 05:16 PM
#13
  • ben74
  • Senior Member
  • Perth, Australia
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(08-27-2014, 10:35 AM)Lradke Wrote: Just for the sake not not creating a new thread, I'll ask this here.

What would the difference be between EW and HMW? I have read a few threads on other sites stating there is almost no difference between the two. Is this true?

HMW has softer and whiter tips.

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 08-27-2014, 05:16 PM
#14
  • Lradke
  • Senior Member
  • Edmonton, Alberta
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(08-27-2014, 05:16 PM)ben74 Wrote:
(08-27-2014, 10:35 AM)Lradke Wrote: Just for the sake not not creating a new thread, I'll ask this here.

What would the difference be between EW and HMW? I have read a few threads on other sites stating there is almost no difference between the two. Is this true?

HMW has softer and whiter tips.
Are they significantly softer than the EW?

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 08-27-2014, 05:19 PM
#15
  • ben74
  • Senior Member
  • Perth, Australia
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HMW is more consistent than EW, so the majority of the time there is a noticeable difference. When comparing 2 band HMW and 2 EW the difference is often less significant...

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 08-27-2014, 05:20 PM
#16
  • Lradke
  • Senior Member
  • Edmonton, Alberta
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(08-27-2014, 05:19 PM)ben74 Wrote: HMW is more consistent than EW, so the majority of the time there is a noticeable difference. When comparing 2 band HMW and 2 EW the difference is often less significant...
I see. Thanks! Smile

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 08-27-2014, 05:35 PM
#17
  • ben74
  • Senior Member
  • Perth, Australia
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An interesting fact about Plisson is that they consider 2 band to be inferior to 3 band, despite it appearing in some of their largest and most expensive brushes...

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 08-27-2014, 05:37 PM
#18
  • Agravic
  • Super Moderator
  • Pennsylvania, USA
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(08-27-2014, 05:35 PM)ben74 Wrote: An interesting fact about Plisson is that they consider 2 band to be inferior to 3 band, despite it appearing in some of their largest and most expensive brushes...

Is this a regional thing, i.e. preference of French tastes, or does it have to do with relative availability of natural 3-band vs 2-band hairs from their suppliers?
Very interesting factoid.

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 08-27-2014, 05:43 PM
#19
  • ben74
  • Senior Member
  • Perth, Australia
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I don't believe it has anything to do with supply, but more the perception of tip softness and a strong adherence to tradition. In the shaving world, 2 band is still a relatively new "fad" with backbone being a nouveau preference.

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 08-27-2014, 05:48 PM
#20
  • Agravic
  • Super Moderator
  • Pennsylvania, USA
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Very interesting; thanks, Ben.

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