01-29-2016, 12:05 PM
#1
  • iKon
  • Vendor/Mfg.
  • NYC
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Something quite interesting that brings a new dynamic.

Using 2 Double Edge blades per shave, some may or may not see a perceived and or noticeable difference.

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 01-29-2016, 12:27 PM
#2
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I don't get it.  What did you do, just stack one on top of the other?  

I would think that if the razor wasn't specifically designed to hold two blades, stacking them wouldn't really hold any advantages over using a single blade.  For the two blades to actually do anything, there would need to be a gap between them.

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 01-29-2016, 12:34 PM
#3
  • Gabe
  • Senior Member
  • Arizona
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(01-29-2016, 12:27 PM)kingfisher Wrote: I don't get it.  What did you do, just stack one on top of the other?  

I would think that if the razor wasn't specifically designed to hold two blades, stacking them wouldn't really hold any advantages over using a single blade.  For the two blades to actually do anything, there would need to be a gap between them.
+1

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 01-29-2016, 12:59 PM
#4
  • Mel S Meles
  • On the edge, ouch
  • 44.4899° south of the North Pole
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(01-29-2016, 12:27 PM)kingfisher Wrote: I don't get it.  What did you do, just stack one on top of the other?  

I would think that if the razor wasn't specifically designed to hold two blades, stacking them wouldn't really hold any advantages over using a single blade.  For the two blades to actually do anything, there would need to be a gap between them.

Consciously or not, you may have bought into the Gillette advertising agency’s original 1970s description of how the then new Trac II functioned, with illustrations of whiskers being tugged out by the first blade and then sliced off by the second blade.  There is no reason to believe that the description originated anywhere other than in the advertising executive’s fertile imagination; and the explanation of how the Trac II worked had anomalies on its face.  How could the operation be observed to validate the theory:  where would the camera be located?  If the first blade was sharp enough to penetrate deeply enough into the whisker to pull it upward, why did it not slice all the way through the whisker instead of pulling it upward?  If the second blade could cut all the way through the whisker, why couldn’t the first blade have cut all the way through the whisker?  

Addressing Greg’s suggestion of loading two blades, stacked, I can imagine some benefit that might occur without any gap between the blades.  Provided the blade pair is properly clamped down by the top cap, one would expect the paired blades to be much stiffer than a single blade would be.   Just as we speculate that some of the benefit ascribed to a blade-torquing slant razor may be due to the additional stiffness that the torquing imparts rather than to the slanted slicing action, so a double-thick blade may enjoy a similar benefit.  My personal experience, using an iKon OC Deluxe base plate which curves down and away from the edge of the blade and does not give a lot of “underside” support near the cutting edge, has been that a thick (heavy gauge) KAI blade works better than a much thinner Feather blade, even though the Feather and the KAI are both very sharp; and I find it is easy to speculate that a clamped-together pair of Feathers might close the gap, as it were, and give KAI-like results with the same iKon baseplate.  (I would expect less or no improvement in stiffness from doubling KAI blades.)  There is a hypothesis worth exploration.

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 01-29-2016, 02:09 PM
#5
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I don't understand the benefits. Are you contemplating a new double bladed design?

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 01-29-2016, 02:39 PM
#6
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The BFG of shaving:

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BFG


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 01-29-2016, 03:17 PM
#7
  • iKon
  • Vendor/Mfg.
  • NYC
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Perhaps measuring the "2 blade gap" would clarify it.



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 01-29-2016, 03:19 PM
#8
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Wouldn't it be shimming it except not cutting the old edge off the blade.it does make it more aggressive.  Does the bkade still feel as sharp since you are doubling the thickness of the edge?

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 01-29-2016, 03:57 PM
#9
  • iKon
  • Vendor/Mfg.
  • NYC
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(01-29-2016, 03:19 PM)John Wayne Wrote: Wouldn't it be shimming it except not cutting the old edge off the blade.it does make it more aggressive.  Does the bkade still feel as sharp since you are doubling the thickness of the edge?

Dynamic Usage Of Cutting Edge

[Image: IMG_3665.jpg]

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 01-29-2016, 04:19 PM
#10
  • Mouser
  • Senior Member
  • Forest City, Florida U.S.A.
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Well, to answer one question, if the second blade is close enough it will arrive at the pulled whisker before the first blade cuts thru it and while it's being tugged up. As to it being observed, I doubt it.

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 01-29-2016, 05:21 PM
#11
  • Mel S Meles
  • On the edge, ouch
  • 44.4899° south of the North Pole
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(01-29-2016, 04:19 PM)Mouser Wrote: Well, to answer one question,  if the second blade is close enough it will arrive at the pulled whisker before the first blade cuts thru it and while it's being tugged up. As to it being observed,  I doubt it.

If the blade is sharp enough to cut the whisker, then it will cut through the whisker without pulling it up; it will simply slice right on through the hair shaft.  If you ever have tweezed an individual whisker from your beard, then you know how much force you needed to pull out the whisker; you never use anywhere near that much force when pulling a razor across your face.  Take your sharpest honed-to-a-fine-edge machete out to the garden and see whether you can lift even a small green twig upwards by applying the sharp edge horizontally to the shaft of the twig; that is what you are suggesting that the first blade of a twin-blade razor is doing.  Unless the razor blade is very, very dull, there never will be a “pulled whisker.”

The business edge of a double edge razor blade is chamfered toward the cutting edge; when clamped together, the two edges would have a V-shaped gap between them approximately equal at the leading edge to the thickness of the steel that the two blades were made from.   (That is, assuming that each blade is sharpened on both sides; a blade could be sharpened on one side only, and if the two unsharpened — flat —sides were clamped together, then the siamesed combination would act like one blade.)

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 01-30-2016, 12:48 PM
#12
  • chazt
  • Senior Member
  • Bayside, NY
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The gentleman from Weird Portland makes a lot of sense.  Sisi

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 01-30-2016, 06:13 PM
#13
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This thread seems pretty pointless to me. The OP doesn't explain himself very well and then gives ambiguous unhelpful replies to genuine questions, leaving others to guess what the advantage of using two DE blades in a razor designed for one is. ??


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 01-30-2016, 06:42 PM
#14
  • Mouser
  • Senior Member
  • Forest City, Florida U.S.A.
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(01-29-2016, 05:21 PM)Mel S Meles Wrote:
(01-29-2016, 04:19 PM)Mouser Wrote: Well, to answer one question,  if the second blade is close enough it will arrive at the pulled whisker before the first blade cuts thru it and while it's being tugged up. As to it being observed,  I doubt it.

If the blade is sharp enough to cut the whisker, then it will cut through the whisker without pulling it up; it will simply slice right on through the hair shaft.  If you ever have tweezed an individual whisker from your beard, then you know how much force you needed to pull out the whisker; you never use anywhere near that much force when pulling a razor across your face.  Take your sharpest honed-to-a-fine-edge machete out to the garden and see whether you can lift even a small green twig upwards by applying the sharp edge horizontally to the shaft of the twig; that is what you are suggesting that the first blade of a twin-blade razor is doing.  Unless the razor blade is very, very dull, there never will be a “pulled whisker.”

The business edge of a double edge razor blade is chamfered toward the cutting edge; when clamped together, the two edges would have a V-shaped gap between them approximately equal at the leading edge to the thickness of the steel that the two blades were made from.   (That is, assuming that each blade is sharpened on both sides; a blade could be sharpened on one side only, and if the two unsharpened — flat —sides were clamped together, then the siamesed combination would act like one blade.)

No need to go into such a lengthy explanation for me, I'm just giving the company line on the question. It's why I say " I doubt it " to the question of has it been observed.

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 01-30-2016, 08:41 PM
#15
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I've accidentally shaved with two blades in my DE razor.

It was awful.

Wouldn't do it on purpose. The twin blade DE blades and injector blades I have that were made that way on purpose have a staggered edge. There's a tiny gap between the two edges on each side as the upper blade is slightly narrower.

They don't shave any better than a single DE blade. The SE blades with twin edges almost immediately clog up with stubble too.

Is there something I'm missing? Aren't most brands of DE blades the same width? The curve of the razor head wouldn't separate the edges appreciably.

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 01-30-2016, 10:40 PM
#16
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(01-30-2016, 08:41 PM)bakerbarber Wrote: I've accidentally shaved with two blades in my DE razor.

It was awful.

Wouldn't do it on purpose. The twin blade DE blades and injector blades I have that were made that way on purpose have a staggered edge. There's a tiny gap between the two edges on each side as the upper blade is slightly narrower.

They don't shave any better than a single DE blade. The SE blades with twin edges almost immediately clog up with stubble too.

Is there something I'm missing? Aren't most brands of DE blades the same width? The curve of the razor head wouldn't separate the edges appreciably.

Agreed, tried it today despite my better judgement. Loaded the Wolfman up with 2 Astra blades. Couldn't tell by looking at it that it had two blades in it. I did take some photos but they didn't really come out. Certainly couldn't tell that it had two separate edges. Shave felt like it was twice as aggressive but half as efficient. Have terrible rash and nowhere near smooth as normal. Anyway,  now I know and won't have to die wondering. 

Not sure if I'll buy any Ikon razors on that advice though.

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 01-31-2016, 06:22 AM
#17
  • sch1989
  • Senior Member
  • Mesa arizona
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I did this by accident with a King cobra and the shave was more aggressive but not enjoyable.

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 01-31-2016, 06:28 AM
#18
  • ben74
  • Senior Member
  • Perth, Australia
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(01-31-2016, 06:22 AM)sch1989 Wrote: I did this by accident with a King cobra and the shave was more aggressive but not enjoyable.

Me too, I had a packet of Kai Mild blades that kept dispensing 2 blades at a time. I was wondering why I was having such awful shaves all of a sudden. On inspecting the blade I found that 2 were stuck together. This happened multiple times with this particular packet, but never before and never since...

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 01-31-2016, 08:36 AM
#19
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(01-30-2016, 12:48 PM)chazt Wrote: The gentleman from Weird Portland makes a lot of sense.  Sisi

It seems like it makes sense, but it's simply not true.  Don't get me wrong, I'm not a proponent of multibladed razors; I use a DE everyday.  But the idea that the blades are sharp enough to go right through a beard hair without pulling at all is just wrong.  Beard hairs are strong, and they do get pulled out just a little bit when you attack them with a blade.  Gillette has ultra-close-up highly magnified video proof of it; there is no question in my mind that most (if not all) the time when you attempt to slice through a hair, it tugs the hair a bit before it slices through.  

And yes, the second blade does, too.  And third, and fourth, and fifth, and so on, if there are more blades.  

Still, the only advantage of said tugging and having the first blade followed by a second is to have the second blade tug slightly and then cut through the hair before it has a chance to fully retract from the slight tugging given it by the first blade.  If the blades are too close together it seems to me that it would only increase the tug without cutting any closer, thereby providing a similar shave outcome by a more uncomfortable method.  This intuition seems to be supported by the empiric data by a couple of posters in this thread.  

So the gap between the blades and the angle of each of the blades has to be very carefully controlled if one wants to achieve a closer shave without greatly increasing the irritation of said shave.  Bottom line:  putting two DE blades into a DE razor and shaving still doesn't really make that much sense to me.

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 01-31-2016, 09:39 AM
#20
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Wouldn't it be easier to find an old Gillette Trac II?

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