02-09-2016, 06:11 AM
#21
  • Johnny
  • MODERATOR EMERITUS
  • Wausau, Wisconsin, USA
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What I am about to say is my opinion only and I do not speak for other mods or admins.

If a person wants more that the listed selling price of say (the Cobra) maybe they should list it on eBay.  Then when they sell it there they can pay the eBay fees for doing so.

Our B/S/T does not charge a fee for selling.

And, let's say a seller paid $300 for a $240 razor and want to recoup his money, that's his problem not ours that he paid more than the item was worth.

178 23,809
 02-09-2016, 06:14 AM
#22
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(02-09-2016, 04:52 AM)fgeib07 Wrote:
(02-09-2016, 04:39 AM)david1201 Wrote: I buy a fair number of custom brushes 2nd hand that I have no idea how much they cost new, sometimes on other forums.  How am I supposed to address that situation?
Good question I wonder the same

If you feel it's not worth any less than what you paid then sell it at that price. You can always prove what you paid. Unless I overlooked it they didn't state you had to lower the price. Just keeping people from marking something up just to profit off every one.

147 3,536
 02-09-2016, 06:21 AM
#23
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I agree with Johnny. I see tons of shaving stuff way over priced on auction sites and people pay it. You just have to know what to post for sale and what not to ask for an item. I understand if you paid more for an item and want to recoup your money but now you have to be more cautious.

49 356
 02-09-2016, 06:26 AM
#24
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But won't we all as buyers wind up paying the higher ebay prices instead of maybe something in the middle here on TSN? Maybe I'm way off base, but a lower price here on TSN, even if higher than new, is better than paying a higher price on ebay.

That said, I'd prefer not to spend anymore money on gear this year anyway Smile

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 02-09-2016, 06:36 AM
#25
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Whoops, sorry for starting a new thread and thank you for merging. Can't believe I missed this one!

55 923
 02-09-2016, 07:03 AM
#26
  • bullgoose
  • The Enabler
  • Redondo Beach, California, U.S.A
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We are being generous...many shaving sites require you to list a used item at a certain percentage under retail. In the real world, personal use items lose value over time. If your M&F brush were to be stolen from your home, there is no way that the insurance company is going to pay you more than it cost new.

We are allowing members to recover full retail value even for a used item. To expect to turn a profit on a current production item is not in the spirit of TSN.

46 18,344
 02-09-2016, 07:13 AM
#27
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(02-09-2016, 07:03 AM)bullgoose Wrote: We are being generous...many shaving sites require you to list a used item at a certain percentage under retail.

Absolutely, and believe me, it is much appreciated. One of the greatest things about this forum is how laid back it is and easy to use. Thanks!

55 923
 02-09-2016, 07:14 AM
#28
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I think it will be a good change. I don't think there is any room for profiteering on a friendly community BST. That said, my only entry into the suggestion box would be to make the rule that you don't sell it for more than you paid for it, rather than don't sell it for more than market value. Just state what you paid and list it at or below that price. The seller would not be profiting, assuming they are being honest, and I like to give people the benefit of the doubt. Market value is a little more complicated to figure out and we can end up with people bickering over data sources. But I can live with either way.

40 1,166
 02-09-2016, 07:17 AM
#29
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(02-09-2016, 06:08 AM)bullgoose Wrote:
(02-09-2016, 04:39 AM)david1201 Wrote: I buy a fair number of custom brushes 2nd hand that I have no idea how much they cost new, sometimes on other forums.  How am I supposed to address that situation?

You will simply have to do some research before listing.

Understand Phil, and most cases I agree wholeheartedly.  M&F brushes are a classic example, I have no idea what new costs currently are (or the price when the brush was bought for that matter), and the fair market value of these seems to be higher than retail because of the difficulty obtaining these.

Doesn't seem right that if I buy an item at a fair market value price which is above retail that I won't be able to sell it on The Shave Nook without taking a big hit.

What I think will ultimately happen is that with this policy these hard-to-obtain items (M&F, UFO, Wolfman to name a few off the top of my head) will no longer be listed for sale on TSN, which is disappointing as I and many others much prefer to buy and sell here than on ebay or any of the other shaving forums.

53 1,199
 02-09-2016, 07:20 AM
#30
  • bullgoose
  • The Enabler
  • Redondo Beach, California, U.S.A
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(02-09-2016, 07:14 AM)shevek Wrote: I think it will be a good change. I don't think there is any room for profiteering on a friendly community BST. That said, my only entry into the suggestion box would be to make the rule that you don't sell it for more than you paid for it, rather than don't sell it for more than market value. Just state what you paid and list it at or below that price. The seller would not be profiting, assuming they are being honest, and I like to give people the benefit of the doubt. Market value is a little more complicated to figure out and we can end up with people bickering over data sources. But I can live with either way.

We do not want to assume anything. Retail price is easy to look up. Also, if someone happened to overpay for an item, we do not want to be part of the cycle. The rule is firm and it is fair, you cannot ask for more than retail price. Period. 

For those jumping into the thread late...this does not include vintage items.

46 18,344
 02-09-2016, 07:21 AM
#31
  • Johnny
  • MODERATOR EMERITUS
  • Wausau, Wisconsin, USA
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The two key phrases in this new rule are:

Current retail price
Current production items

If you are selling for example a gold Gillette Toggle, list it for what you think it is worth (with some research).  The market will let you know if you are correct.

178 23,809
 02-09-2016, 07:23 AM
#32
  • 55dougie
  • Doug Korn's Workshop - Artisan
  • NY USA
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Nice upgrade to the BST Phil  Thumbsup

24 611
 02-09-2016, 07:39 AM
#33
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The positives will far outweigh the negatives IMO.  Thanks a lot for the new policy mods.  I think it will save the BST in the long-run.

83 423
 02-09-2016, 07:41 AM
#34
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(02-09-2016, 06:26 AM)buickrob Wrote: But won't we all as buyers wind up paying the higher ebay prices instead of maybe something in the middle here on TSN?  Maybe I'm way off base, but a lower price here on TSN, even if higher than new, is better than paying a higher price on ebay.  

That said, I'd prefer not to spend anymore money on gear this year anyway Smile

If there is an item you are looking for you could always post a WTB and you may come up with it at a reasonable price. Profiteering is going to happen with in-demand scarce items. I think the goal of this rule is to not foster it here at the Nook. I enthusiastically support the policy.

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 02-09-2016, 07:41 AM
#35
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(02-09-2016, 07:20 AM)bullgoose Wrote:
(02-09-2016, 07:14 AM)shevek Wrote: I think it will be a good change. I don't think there is any room for profiteering on a friendly community BST. That said, my only entry into the suggestion box would be to make the rule that you don't sell it for more than you paid for it, rather than don't sell it for more than market value. Just state what you paid and list it at or below that price. The seller would not be profiting, assuming they are being honest, and I like to give people the benefit of the doubt. Market value is a little more complicated to figure out and we can end up with people bickering over data sources. But I can live with either way.

We do not want to assume anything. Retail price is easy to look up. Also, if someone happened to overpay for an item, we do not want to be part of the cycle. The rule is firm and it is fair, you cannot ask for more than retail price. Period. 

For those jumping into the thread late...this does not include vintage items.

Ok, fair enough. I can understand it being easier to deal with from a moderation standpoint. Thank you for the explanation.

40 1,166
 02-09-2016, 08:26 AM
#36
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(02-09-2016, 07:17 AM)david1201 Wrote:
(02-09-2016, 06:08 AM)bullgoose Wrote:
(02-09-2016, 04:39 AM)david1201 Wrote: I buy a fair number of custom brushes 2nd hand that I have no idea how much they cost new, sometimes on other forums.  How am I supposed to address that situation?

You will simply have to do some research before listing.

Understand Phil, and most cases I agree wholeheartedly.  M&F brushes are a classic example, I have no idea what new costs currently are (or the price when the brush was bought for that matter), and the fair market value of these seems to be higher than retail because of the difficulty obtaining these.

Doesn't seem right that if I buy an item at a fair market value price which is above retail that I won't be able to sell it on The Shave Nook without taking a big hit.

What I think will ultimately happen is that with this policy these hard-to-obtain items (M&F, UFO, Wolfman to name a few off the top of my head) will no longer be listed for sale on TSN, which is disappointing as I and many others much prefer to buy and sell here than on ebay or any of the other shaving forums.

Sadly, I think this is what will happen.

23 656
 02-09-2016, 08:45 AM
#37
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Seems pretty cut and dry to me. We are all guests in Phils house so we need to respect his rules. He doesn't want people making money on his site plain and simple.  IMO that's not too much to ask. All the exceptions and loopholes people may or may not try to find its simple. He doesn't want people turning profits on here. If you overpaid that's on you. When the new wears off on that item you overpaid for don't expect someone to do the same on here.

Lots of places are like that. They just want to keep the comradery going and not make it about turning a profit .

Look at it like this . The fact there is a BST on a forum from a vendor is a privilege in itself. I know if I were a dealer I'd want the business coming to me and my business. No doubt Phil could shut the BST down and be like hey if you want something get it from bullgoose. His house his rules and he has every right to do that. The fact he's taken a hit when someone sells an item he carries is enough to respect his wishes.

0 127
 02-09-2016, 08:51 AM
#38
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(02-09-2016, 08:26 AM)Starkicker Wrote:
(02-09-2016, 07:17 AM)david1201 Wrote:
(02-09-2016, 06:08 AM)bullgoose Wrote: You will simply have to do some research before listing.

Understand Phil, and most cases I agree wholeheartedly.  M&F brushes are a classic example, I have no idea what new costs currently are (or the price when the brush was bought for that matter), and the fair market value of these seems to be higher than retail because of the difficulty obtaining these.

Doesn't seem right that if I buy an item at a fair market value price which is above retail that I won't be able to sell it on The Shave Nook without taking a big hit.

What I think will ultimately happen is that with this policy these hard-to-obtain items (M&F, UFO, Wolfman to name a few off the top of my head) will no longer be listed for sale on TSN, which is disappointing as I and many others much prefer to buy and sell here than on ebay or any of the other shaving forums.

Sadly, I think this is what will happen.

I agree. This change may harm the BST as a change in a similar fashion harmed the BST of another large forum. I think that members are wise enough and no one will pay too high of a price, and no one pays a high asked price because it is a friendly environment. I think that retail price disclosure is a good idea I don't think that price caps will lead to any desirable outcome and will only "kill the market". I see no harm if someone sells a Wolfman at a price between the retail and the ebay/market price and all sides of the transaction are happy.

8 98
 02-09-2016, 08:58 AM
#39
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(02-09-2016, 08:51 AM)ofercohen Wrote:
(02-09-2016, 08:26 AM)Starkicker Wrote:
(02-09-2016, 07:17 AM)david1201 Wrote: Understand Phil, and most cases I agree wholeheartedly.  M&F brushes are a classic example, I have no idea what new costs currently are (or the price when the brush was bought for that matter), and the fair market value of these seems to be higher than retail because of the difficulty obtaining these.

Doesn't seem right that if I buy an item at a fair market value price which is above retail that I won't be able to sell it on The Shave Nook without taking a big hit.

What I think will ultimately happen is that with this policy these hard-to-obtain items (M&F, UFO, Wolfman to name a few off the top of my head) will no longer be listed for sale on TSN, which is disappointing as I and many others much prefer to buy and sell here than on ebay or any of the other shaving forums.

Sadly, I think this is what will happen.

I agree. This change may harm the BST as a change in a similar fashion harmed the BST of another large forum. I think that members are wise enough and no one will pay too high of a price, and no one pays a high asked price because it is a friendly environment. I think that retail price disclosure is a good idea I don't think that price caps will lead to any desirable outcome and will only "kill the market". I see no harm if someone sells a Wolfman at a price between the retail and the ebay/market price and all sides of the transaction are happy.

Problem is the owner of the site doesn't want it like that.  I read Phils post as a requirement not a discussion.  Like I said in my previous post his house his rules.

0 127
 02-09-2016, 09:03 AM
#40
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(02-09-2016, 08:58 AM)John Wayne Wrote: Problem is the owner of the site doesn't want it like that.  I read Phils post as a requirement not a discussion.  Like I said in my previous post his house his rules.

Sure, it is his forum and he decides about the rules of the game. I thought this thread can be used for members to express their thoughts and opinions.

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