06-16-2017, 01:49 PM
#21
  • Mouser
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(06-16-2017, 12:17 PM)Nero Wrote:
(06-10-2017, 06:14 AM)primotenore Wrote:
(06-10-2017, 06:10 AM)Steelman Wrote: Happy Anniversary Primo!  

..and Amen to the vintage stuff.

Soaps
watches
suits/clothing
pens
etc....
Thanks Ron.
I had a fantastic vintage AOS shave today. I have no idea how this could be proved, but I want to see a modern (artisan or not...semantics) soap that performs better than AOS Tallow. 

I've tried something like 400 different soaps and creams. Conclusion: Don't bother holding your breath!!! You have found the best, period. For me it's not even a discussion. I'm happy to try other things but I have no expectations that anything will ever match the AoS tallow.
One word. Yardley.

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 06-16-2017, 04:05 PM
#22
  • Nero
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(06-16-2017, 01:49 PM)Mouser Wrote:
(06-16-2017, 12:17 PM)Nero Wrote:
(06-10-2017, 06:14 AM)primotenore Wrote: Thanks Ron.
I had a fantastic vintage AOS shave today. I have no idea how this could be proved, but I want to see a modern (artisan or not...semantics) soap that performs better than AOS Tallow. 

I've tried something like 400 different soaps and creams. Conclusion: Don't bother holding your breath!!! You have found the best, period. For me it's not even a discussion. I'm happy to try other things but I have no expectations that anything will ever match the AoS tallow.
One word. Yardley.


Several words: had them, sold them

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 06-16-2017, 04:33 PM
#23
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I still love my remaining AOS and its derivatives but I disagree that nothing compares.  At the time AOS changed formulas, we just didn't have so many high quality choices.  Then again, we still have Valobra and C&S.  Win-win.

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 06-16-2017, 08:41 PM
#24
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I dunno, Castle Forbes is pretty darned freaking good. And people rave about Xpec, but I cannot bring myself to pay so much for shave cream just to try it. I mean, CF was so darned good that was the gold standard against which I compared my own experiments. I had to do better or else there was no point in taking it to market. And I hear the Creighton creams are very good.

Also, I'm pretty sure the factory that made AoS creams is still around. That said, I kind of doubt shaving cream is their main product since there aren't nearly as many buyers for it as other cosmetics (ie women's products).

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 06-17-2017, 03:37 AM
#25
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XPEC is phenomenal. Yes, better than CF, which used to be the golden standard.
Creighton's creams are overrated. (People just like the scents but that isn't what we are talking about. If you removed the scents from all products and people made decisions solely on performance, no one would buy Creighton's creams ever.)
AoS creams are easily in top 5 creams maybe higher, even number 1. Definitely better than any Creighton's cream I've used.

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 06-17-2017, 05:20 AM
#26
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(06-17-2017, 03:37 AM)Nero Wrote: XPEC is phenomenal. Yes, better than CF, which used to be the golden standard.
Creighton's creams are overrated. (People just like the scents but that isn't what we are talking about. If you removed the scents from all products and people made decisions solely on performance, no one would buy Creighton's creams ever.)
AoS creams are easily in top 5 creams maybe higher, even number 1. Definitely better than any Creighton's cream I've used.
Not only would they never buy Creighton's, but I venture to guess that they wouldn't purchase 75% of the other soap offerings available. THEN, everyone would want our precious vintage AOS and Tallow Williams soaps... 24  There would be total anarchy. 

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 06-17-2017, 02:43 PM
#27
  • Quando
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Okay, I feel I should chime in.  

First of all, AoS has been a mass-market, big box, put one anywhere we can, like McDonald's, type company.  I have no idea why you expect any consistency from them, in the first place.

Secondly, big companies change formulas only reluctantly, and, only when they need to.  This is, usually, because of the price of the ingredients fluctuating beyond the point where it would be profitable, to continue to use them.  The only reason any company exists is to make money.  This is true for any company.  

If I were the OP, I would simply find a different type of shaving soap.  There are plenty, from which to choose.

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 06-17-2017, 04:13 PM
#28
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(06-17-2017, 02:43 PM)Quando Wrote: Okay, I feel I should chime in.  

First of all, AoS has been a mass-market, big box, put one anywhere we can, like McDonald's, type company.  I have no idea why you expect any consistency from them, in the first place.

Secondly, big companies change formulas only reluctantly, and, only when they need to.  This is, usually, because of the price of the ingredients fluctuating beyond the point where it would be profitable, to continue to use them.  The only reason any company exists is to make money.  This is true for any company.  

If I were the OP, I would simply find a different type of shaving soap.  There are plenty, from which to choose.
Thank you. I am the OP and I have found all of the soap that I need. I was simply musing. I do that sometimes. You'll get used to it.

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 06-23-2017, 04:15 PM
#29
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(06-17-2017, 04:13 PM)primotenore Wrote:
(06-17-2017, 02:43 PM)Quando Wrote: Okay, I feel I should chime in.  

First of all, AoS has been a mass-market, big box, put one anywhere we can, like McDonald's, type company.  I have no idea why you expect any consistency from them, in the first place.

Secondly, big companies change formulas only reluctantly, and, only when they need to.  This is, usually, because of the price of the ingredients fluctuating beyond the point where it would be profitable, to continue to use them.  The only reason any company exists is to make money.  This is true for any company.  

If I were the OP, I would simply find a different type of shaving soap.  There are plenty, from which to choose.
Thank you. I am the OP and I have found all of the soap that I need. I was simply musing. I do that sometimes. You'll get used to it.

Glad to hear (read) it.

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 06-25-2017, 05:51 AM
#30
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(06-16-2017, 04:05 PM)LNero Wrote:
(06-16-2017, 01:49 PM)Mouser Wrote:
(06-16-2017, 12:17 PM)Nero Wrote: I've tried something like 400 different soaps and creams. Conclusion: Don't bother holding your breath!!! You have found the best, period. For me it's not even a discussion. I'm happy to try other things but I have no expectations that anything will ever match the AoS tallow.
One word. Yardley.


Several words: had them, sold them
Which is why, in the end, you have to try and find your best on your own. My habit of keeping a daily shave log began just as something to do, being in forced retirement.  If it wasnt for that I would have a couple different soaps tied at the top. Being able to review every shave over the last four years, except when my health dictated a no shave day slowly brought light on the facts of which products resulted in the fewest weepers or blood or even which ones never brought forth the hemoglobin.  Which ones were most likely being used during my closest, most comfortable  shaves. Without it i would have put Xpec, Valobra, C&S, Yardley, MWF, Tabac, Pens tallows and others both pricey and not at the top too close to call. But upon pouring over the four years of notes, it's Yardley .
The same process led me to using vintage blades only and a price point that i needed to stay at or under depending on make.

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 06-28-2017, 07:48 AM
#31
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Exactly, YMMV in all things.
I sold the Yardley regular/lavender long ago because I owned 4 of the Black Label (much better and stronger scent). Then I realized my skin is sensitive to the fragrance in Black Label, so I sold those too.

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 06-28-2017, 08:13 AM
#32
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(06-28-2017, 07:48 AM)Nero Wrote: Exactly, YMMV in all things.
I sold the Yardley regular/lavender long ago because I owned 4 of the Black Label (much better and stronger scent). Then I realized my skin is sensitive to the fragrance in Black Label, so I sold those too.
I would LOVE to score a tub of the Yardley Black Label.

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 06-28-2017, 03:46 PM
#33
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(06-28-2017, 07:48 AM)Nero Wrote: Exactly, YMMV in all things.
I sold the Yardley regular/lavender long ago because I owned 4 of the Black Label (much better and stronger scent). Then I realized my skin is sensitive to the fragrance in Black Label, so I sold those too.

God! I would love a tub of black label, but availability  and a pocket full of extra coinage never has coincided.

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 06-29-2017, 07:22 PM
#34
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(06-28-2017, 03:46 PM)Mouser Wrote:
(06-28-2017, 07:48 AM)Nero Wrote: Exactly, YMMV in all things.
I sold the Yardley regular/lavender long ago because I owned 4 of the Black Label (much better and stronger scent). Then I realized my skin is sensitive to the fragrance in Black Label, so I sold those too.

God! I would love a tub of black label, but availability  and a pocket full of extra coinage never has coincided.


(06-28-2017, 08:13 AM)primotenore Wrote:
(06-28-2017, 07:48 AM)Nero Wrote: Exactly, YMMV in all things.
I sold the Yardley regular/lavender long ago because I owned 4 of the Black Label (much better and stronger scent). Then I realized my skin is sensitive to the fragrance in Black Label, so I sold those too.
I would LOVE to score a tub of the Yardley Black Label.

Wish I still had them to help you both out. Sorry!!!!

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 06-30-2017, 04:50 AM
#35
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(06-29-2017, 07:22 PM)Nero Wrote:
(06-28-2017, 03:46 PM)Mouser Wrote:
(06-28-2017, 07:48 AM)Nero Wrote: Exactly, YMMV in all things.
I sold the Yardley regular/lavender long ago because I owned 4 of the Black Label (much better and stronger scent). Then I realized my skin is sensitive to the fragrance in Black Label, so I sold those too.

God! I would love a tub of black label, but availability  and a pocket full of extra coinage never has coincided.


(06-28-2017, 08:13 AM)primotenore Wrote:
(06-28-2017, 07:48 AM)Nero Wrote: Exactly, YMMV in all things.
I sold the Yardley regular/lavender long ago because I owned 4 of the Black Label (much better and stronger scent). Then I realized my skin is sensitive to the fragrance in Black Label, so I sold those too.
I would LOVE to score a tub of the Yardley Black Label.

Wish I still had them to help you both out. Sorry!!!!
Biggrin

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 Yesterday, 08:36 AM
#36
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I wonder if part of the issue is U.K. regulations and perhaps availability of the required raw materials to produce the soaps (obviously not applicable to Williams). I would agree that with the size of those companies there is a Corporate component that plays into it. When these companies started they were likely helmed by folks who were wet shavers/barbers, and that has likely changed over the 100+ years they've been around.

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 11 hours ago
#37
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Score... Biggrin
[Image: 1c1Rjc2.jpg]

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 7 hours ago
#38
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The simple answer is that it is all about the money when changes are made. Especially when some new Bean Counter arrives and has some power. Those same Bean Counters are stupid when they have no idea what works well should stay. They simply focus on saving some beans!!

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 7 hours ago
#39
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I think a lot of the decisions get made post acquisition in a windowless corporate office. AOS was reformulated after P&G took over. It was also P&G who axed Old Spice shave soap in 1991 shortly after they took over the company.
Williams was reformulated each time it changed hands about 5-6 times since the 70's. I doubt Combe even 'makes' the soap anymore and just buys soap noodles and process it into the abomination we know today.

I'm surprised AOS tallow is still on ebay, that guy must have sold a couple thousand pucks already.

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