06-12-2017, 12:14 PM
#1
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So I was dumping the idea of a carbon steel frying pan/skillet as it has to be seasoned to work well and can't be washed with soap, as soap will strip the seasoning. Not good for an OCD guy like me.......

But my father use a non stick pan each morning for bacon & eggs and he was getting tired of having to exchange his Scanpan yearly (he takes deglazing a pan to a new level of roughness)

He has absolutely ZERO OCD, so he must be the perfect candidate for a carbon steel pan. Hence I bought him a De Buyer Mineral B 28 cm pan.

I helped him with the seasoning, and learned him the guidelines to get the most out of the pan.

It took 6-8 seasonings on the stove and 2 cycles in the oven, using walnut oil as seasoning oil.

I visit my father once a week and cook for him.
First usage the pan excelled.
My father used the pan the following day and eggs did stick a bit. Bacon was seared to perfection.

He follows the De Buyers instructions.
No soap. No soaking of the pan.
No acids. No overly rough cleaning.
Deglaze pan after usage. Dry clean with paper. Add a drop of oil, wipe the pan clean. Put it away.

Now 3+ months later, and my father has used it daily.

I use it weekly.

Conclusion: Best Pan Ever (for the price)

You can't beat it.

I own several Mauviel, Demeyere, Le Creuset and Staub pans.
For the price, the De Buyer Mineral B is the perfect all round frying pan.

I preferably sear steaks/meat in it. PERFECTION.

But you can cook everything in it. Because you can't clean it thoroughly I would avoid cooking smelly things in it, like fat fish (salmon), but the pan master everything.

I'm so impressed that I just bought 2 De Buyer Mineral B 32 cm pans, one for my father and one for my girl friend.

I will use both pans. And enjoy it.

Is it as non stick as the best non stick pans ?
No, not at first.
But after 20-30 times of daily cooking, it becomes more and more non stick.

It heats up reasonably fast, but copper and PLY are much faster.
It retains heat very well, but cast iron retains heat better.

It sears very evenly.
The handle only gets a little bit hot.

The pan is very thick, yet it weighs only 75% of similar sized pan in cast iron.

Rating overall: 9.5 / 10

[Image: 805746b410594c9789e41bab9f9f096d.jpg]

[Image: 0f82d1eef260a9f9722edb4c0c4d024b.jpg]

[Image: 729ace3ad4832f626b2b88bb865c2b9f.jpg]

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 06-12-2017, 05:22 PM
#2
  • Sully
  • Super Moderator
  • Cedar Park, Texas
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I really like carbon steel pans.  In fact the only time our cast iron gets used is when my wife is trying to make eggs or taco meat.  I use soap and water on my carbon steel and cast iron pans.  I think if the seasoning is good it shouldn't be stripped off by a little soap.

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 06-12-2017, 07:35 PM
#3
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(06-12-2017, 05:22 PM)Sully Wrote: I really like carbon steel pans.  In fact the only time our cast iron gets used is when my wife is trying to make eggs or taco meat.  I use soap and water on my carbon steel and cast iron pans.  I think if the seasoning is good it shouldn't be stripped off by a little soap.


Very interesting to hear this.

So you simply wash your carbon steel pans like any other pan, or are you a bit more gentle with the amount of soap used on the pan and the pressure with the sponge ?

I just wipe the still warm carbon steel pan with kitchen paper, rinse the pan in hot water and wipe it dry with kitchen paper, add a drop of oil to the pan, wipe it into the pan and I'm done.

Interesting if you can actually still use a bit of washing up liquid to clean the carbon steel pan without stripping/hurting the seasoning !!!

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 06-12-2017, 10:14 PM
#4
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Nice one. I guess it's similar to cast iron cookware regarding the soap washing, where my wife does exactly the opposite  Confused

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 06-13-2017, 03:19 AM
#5
  • Mel S Meles
  • On the edge, ouch
  • 44.4899° south of the North Pole
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(06-12-2017, 12:14 PM)CHSeifert Wrote: I bought him a De Buyer Mineral B 28 cm pan.

Conclusion: Best Pan Ever (for the price)

You can't beat it.

Matfer Bourgeat makes a line of “Black Steel” pans that is very similar, pan for pan, to the deBuyer Mineral B pans; but there is one significant difference:  the handles of the pans are welded, not riveted, to the bases of the Matfer Bourgeat pans.  Why is it significant?  There are no rivets inside the working portion of the Matfer Bourgeat around which stuff can accumulate and adhere; the insides of the sidewalls of the Matfer Bourgeat pans are smooth and clear.

I do not know whether deBuyer copied the Matfer Bourgeat design or vice versa; most likely, both lines evolved from a traditional shape and material for French pans in parallel development.

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 06-13-2017, 03:46 AM
#6
  • Sully
  • Super Moderator
  • Cedar Park, Texas
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(06-12-2017, 07:35 PM)CHSeifert Wrote:
(06-12-2017, 05:22 PM)Sully Wrote: I really like carbon steel pans.  In fact the only time our cast iron gets used is when my wife is trying to make eggs or taco meat.  I use soap and water on my carbon steel and cast iron pans.  I think if the seasoning is good it shouldn't be stripped off by a little soap.


Very interesting to hear this.

So you simply wash your carbon steel pans like any other pan, or are you a bit more gentle with the amount of soap used on the pan and the pressure with the sponge ?

I just wipe the still warm carbon steel pan with kitchen paper, rinse the pan in hot water and wipe it dry with kitchen paper, add a drop of oil to the pan, wipe it into the pan and I'm done.

Interesting if you can actually still use a bit of washing up liquid to clean the carbon steel pan without stripping/hurting the seasoning !!!

I wash them like other pans with a few exceptions.  I don't soak cast iron or carbon steel in sink of soapy water.  This article talks about why soap won't strip away seasoning http://www.seriouseats.com/2016/09/how-t...kware.html I don't have any issues using soap and water and a scrubby sponge on my carbon steel pans.  The scrubby sponge I use is supposed to be safe for non-stick pans.  I wouldn't use steel wool on my CS pans because that could damage the seasoning.

Here a re a few interesting articles on cast iron.
I know these articles are about cast iron, I treat my carbon steel the same way I treat my cast iron pans.  

http://www.seriouseats.com/2014/11/the-t...-iron.html
http://www.seriouseats.com/2010/06/how-t...-pans.html

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 06-13-2017, 06:38 AM
#7
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my first job in food service   a long long time ago  I was trained to flip eggs and only used carbon steel.  I tossed a piece of toast 1000s of time to get it perfect.  the pans were great for that era 1960   i prefer others now

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 06-13-2017, 08:51 AM
#8
  • Mel S Meles
  • On the edge, ouch
  • 44.4899° south of the North Pole
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(06-13-2017, 03:46 AM)Sully Wrote:
(06-12-2017, 07:35 PM)CHSeifert Wrote:
(06-12-2017, 05:22 PM)Sully Wrote: I really like carbon steel pans.  In fact the only time our cast iron gets used is when my wife is trying to make eggs or taco meat.  I use soap and water on my carbon steel and cast iron pans.  I think if the seasoning is good it shouldn't be stripped off by a little soap.
Here a re a few interesting articles on cast iron.
I know these articles are about cast iron, I treat my carbon steel the same way I treat my cast iron pans.  

http://www.seriouseats.com/2014/11/the-t...-iron.html
http://www.seriouseats.com/2010/06/how-t...-pans.html

If discussion of cast iron pans is very slightly off-topic in a discussion about carbon steel pans (and I think it was very slight, if it was off-topic at all), then my comment that follows strays quite a bit further off-topic; I apologize in advance.  There was an interesting tangential discussion, in a "sub-reddit" that covers gourmet cooking in the discussion forum Reddit, that went into the authoritativeness of the opinions of the writers on SeriousEats.  That discussion begins with the disclaimer, “I don't really think questions this deep in a comment chain can really be offtopic aside from blatant trolling ...” and can be read by scrolling down the page located here.

We now return you to your on-topic programming.

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 06-16-2017, 12:59 PM
#9
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(06-13-2017, 03:19 AM)Mel S Meles Wrote:
(06-12-2017, 12:14 PM)CHSeifert Wrote: I bought him a De Buyer Mineral B 28 cm pan.

Conclusion: Best Pan Ever (for the price)

You can't beat it.

Matfer Bourgeat makes a line of “Black Steel” pans that is very similar, pan for pan, to the deBuyer Mineral B pans; but there is one significant difference:  the handles of the pans are welded, not riveted, to the bases of the Matfer Bourgeat pans.  Why is it significant?  There are no rivets inside the working portion of the Matfer Bourgeat around which stuff can accumulate and adhere; the insides of the sidewalls of the Matfer Bourgeat pans are smooth and clear.

I do not know whether deBuyer copied the Matfer Bourgeat design or vice versa; most likely, both lines evolved from a traditional shape and material for French pans in parallel development.

I can't find any place where they sell Matfer Black Steel pans locally or in Europe online and I ha ve heard from 3 guys that complaint over the handles being crooked and not mounted square so you can't nest them easily. So I have chosed to live with the way the De Buyer Mineral B handles are mounted even though I have to live with the rivets inside the pan.

I have rivets in my Mauviel M Cook already and no rivets in my Demeyere Pawson pots and pans, and I of course prefer without ridges, but I don't see it as any problem currently when cleaning the pans.

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 06-16-2017, 07:20 PM
#10
  • Mel S Meles
  • On the edge, ouch
  • 44.4899° south of the North Pole
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(06-16-2017, 12:59 PM)CHSeifert Wrote: I can't find any place where they sell Matfer Black Steel pans locally or in Europe online and I ha ve heard from 3 guys that complaint over the handles being crooked and not mounted square so you can't nest them easily. So I have chosed to live with the way the De Buyer Mineral B handles are mounted even though I have to live with the rivets inside the pan.

I have rivets in my Mauviel M Cook already and no rivets in my Demeyere Pawson pots and pans, and I of course prefer without ridges, but I don't see it as any problem currently when cleaning the pans.

In its 2015 September issue, Cooks Illustrated (look for it on-line by dropping the space and adding dot com) tested eight carbon steel pans.  The “winner” of the comparative test was the $44 Matfer Bourgeat.
[Image: fjbX8Cj.jpg]


The runner up, also “Highly Recommended,” was the Blu Skillet, which retails for $230 and is only rarely discounted.  The $80 deBuyer MineralB came in fifth, two spots below the Mauviel M'steel, but still within (though at the bottom of) the test’s “Recommended” group.

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 06-17-2017, 06:03 AM
#11
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I believe we've had this discussion in another thread where steel pans were held in low esteem, but not by me. Maybe I'm living a fantasy but I don't think so.

That test is what prompted me to get my Matfer pans Mel. Months later I had what I wanted, they were unavailable for that long due to the test and the resulting back orders. They're half the price of deBuyer not because they don't work as good or better, but because they're made to be cooked on in a commercial kitchen and not so much for the home cook who needs glitz and a high price to think that it's going to work.

Right now I have the 11 7/8" (?) pan (~8" cooking surface) that is the workhorse, the 9" (?) crepe pan, and the 14" pan. The 14" gets used rarely due to the size and weight. It's almost as heavy as a cast iron pan of the same size.

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 06-17-2017, 06:28 AM
#12
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I have raised my wife's ire (yet again by reading/quoting threads in TSN. You guys enabled my CPAD (Cooking Pan addiction disorder) and she won't let me buy another new toy.

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 06-18-2017, 04:39 AM
#13
  • Mel S Meles
  • On the edge, ouch
  • 44.4899° south of the North Pole
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(06-17-2017, 06:28 AM)jackgoldman123 Wrote: I have raised my wife's ire (yet again by reading/quoting threads in TSN. You guys enabled my CPAD (Cooking Pan addiction disorder) and she won't let me buy another new toy.

We are here to serve.   Bow

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 06-18-2017, 07:22 AM
#14
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Familiar with The Twilight Zone episode "To Serve Man"?

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 06-18-2017, 10:24 AM
#15
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Anyone know of a webshop in Europe, that sells Matfer Bourgeat Black Steel pans ?

I can't seem to find any.........

How do the sides of the Matfer Black Steel compare to the sides of the De Buyer Mineral B pans ?

I like the high sides of the Mineral B pans quite a bit, especially for the first 25-30 times you cook with it and the seasoning is still in the process of building up (protects the stove and the floor with the higer sides, not sauter pan high sides though)

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 06-18-2017, 02:30 PM
#16
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(06-18-2017, 07:22 AM)jackgoldman123 Wrote: Familiar with The Twilight Zone episode "To Serve Man"?

One of the best episodes. I remember it from the first time I saw it when it first aired.

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 06-21-2017, 12:30 AM
#17
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(06-16-2017, 07:20 PM)Mel S Meles Wrote:
(06-16-2017, 12:59 PM)CHSeifert Wrote: I can't find any place where they sell Matfer Black Steel pans locally or in Europe online and I ha ve heard from 3 guys that complaint over the handles being crooked and not mounted square so you can't nest them easily. So I have chosed to live with the way the De Buyer Mineral B handles are mounted even though I have to live with the rivets inside the pan.

I have rivets in my Mauviel M Cook already and no rivets in my Demeyere Pawson pots and pans, and I of course prefer without ridges, but I don't see it as any problem currently when cleaning the pans.

In its 2015 September issue, Cooks Illustrated (look for it on-line by dropping the space and adding dot com) tested eight carbon steel pans.  The “winner” of the comparative test was the $44 Matfer Bourgeat.
[Image: fjbX8Cj.jpg]


The runner up, also “Highly Recommended,” was the Blu Skillet, which retails for $230 and is only rarely discounted.  The $80 deBuyer MineralB came in fifth, two spots below the Mauviel M'steel, but still within (though at the bottom of) the test’s “Recommended” group.


I gave up trying to find the Matfer Black Steel pans.
The Cooks Illustrated only ranked De Buyer Mineral B lower based on handle position, a position I like because it suits my height and hand position, the weight of the pan, a thing I view as a plus because it's the thickest carbon steel pan out there (based on the data I have been able to find) and the fact the reviewer did not season the sides of the pan, based on De Buyers quite poorly written English manual.

The rivets inside the pan is not a problem to me. My Mauviel M Cook all have them. My Demeyere Pawson don't.
No big deal to me.

Thus I just ordered the De Buyer Mineral B 32cm, 28cm and 24cm frying pans !

Thanks to all for your tips and advice.

Especially a thanks to Sully for letting me know, that you can in fact wash a carbon steel pan with soap without harming the seasoning.

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 06-22-2017, 01:41 AM
#18
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An update.
Found Matfer Black Steel pans at a professional restaurant/kitchen store locally in Copenhagen and at prices 75% of the De Buyer.

Will order 2 pans, a 28cm and a 24 cm.

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 06-22-2017, 01:45 AM
#19
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(06-22-2017, 01:41 AM)CHSeifert Wrote: An update.
Found Matfer Black Steel pans at a professional restaurant/kitchen store locally in Copenhagen and at prices 75% of the De Buyer.

Will order 2 pans, a 28cm and a 24 cm.

I just ordered a 24cm De Buyer after reading this thread and see that you found the Matfer. They are not being sold online though.

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