11-20-2012, 06:05 AM
#1
  • DEW
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First off I have a heavy beard with very sensitive skin especially on my neck area. I can only get a burn free shave with a open comb razor. I only have two open comb razors, a Fatip and now a Gillette New Standard and a slew of the bar types from a Merkur 23c, Slim, Schick Krona, and Techs along with several GEM's of different flavors. Only do the open combs give me a burn free shave. Is it the open comb leaves lather before the blade or what? No matter how light I shave with shower, hot water, or oil preps, I still get the burn with a bar type. I have checked the open comb by no prep just lather and shave and no burn with the open comb. Someone wanna help me with understanding this?:Confused

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 11-20-2012, 06:31 AM
#2
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The open comb and lack of gap may make you hold the razor at the correct angle. With closed comb razors it is easier to drop the handle and still cut whiskers but at an angle that can also irritate the skin. YMMV

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 11-20-2012, 06:37 AM
#3
  • DEW
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(11-20-2012, 06:31 AM)SteelTown Wrote: The open comb and lack of gap may make you hold the razor at the correct angle. With closed comb razors it is easier to drop the handle and still cut whiskers but at an angle that can also irritate the skin. YMMV

Thanks for the reply Dan, never thought about the angle thing, I'll try that sometime but for now I'M loving my Open's way to much. Of the two types I like the opens better but they both give BBS shaves.Smile

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 11-20-2012, 06:56 AM
#4
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I'm also a fan of open combs (in fact I think there is some open comb brotherhood around here somewhere Winky).

I do believe that the open comb allows the lather to stay on all the way until the blade cuts the whisker and that can be very beneficial for those of us with very tough, coarse beards and sensitive skin (I'm in this camp too btw Biggrin). The lack of guard bar give you more angles at which you can cut the hair so it may be easier to get a good shave with less pressure. If you aren't hitting the sweet spot with a guard bar then you may try to compensate with more pressure thus giving you burn.

I just had a shave with the only solid guard bar razor that I can get any type of good shave from (Streamline) this morning. I altered my angle just a bit today and received a much improved shave. So much so that it may start to rival my beloved OCMM.

My advice... keep loving this OCs and revisit the closed combs and solid bars occasionally with the tips you receive here in the back of your mind.

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 11-20-2012, 07:46 AM
#5
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I have the same experience, but not sure the reason. I had the worst shaves with my Merkur 33C, but since I started using a long comb NEW and, later, the open comb Cadet, I get close, smooth shaves with little irritation. I also have a very thick beard. I figured my case is probably due to evolving technique, but YMMV.

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 11-20-2012, 07:49 AM
#6
  • DEW
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(11-20-2012, 06:56 AM)SharpSpine Wrote: I'm also a fan of open combs (in fact I think there is some open comb brotherhood around here somewhere Winky).

I do believe that the open comb allows the lather to stay on all the way until the blade cuts the whisker and that can be very beneficial for those of us with very tough, coarse beards and sensitive skin (I'm in this camp too btw Biggrin). The lack of guard bar give you more angles at which you can cut the hair so it may be easier to get a good shave with less pressure. If you aren't hitting the sweet spot with a guard bar then you may try to compensate with more pressure thus giving you burn.

I just had a shave with the only solid guard bar razor that I can get any type of good shave from (Streamline) this morning. I altered my angle just a bit today and received a much improved shave. So much so that it may start to rival my beloved OCMM.

My advice... keep loving this OCs and revisit the closed combs and solid bars occasionally with the tips you receive here in the back of your mind.

Thanks, I guess I'll be joining the Brotherhood of the OC. I guess with safety razors they all have their purpose, flavors, and following. Kinda neat if you think about it. I just can't wait till in the morning for my next shave. I have been known to shave twice in a day, whether I need it or not, and now with no razor burn even more.WinkBiggrin

(11-20-2012, 07:46 AM)sethleupagus Wrote: I have the same experience, but not sure the reason. I had the worst shaves with my Merkur 33C, but since I started using a long comb NEW and, later, the open comb Cadet, I get close, smooth shaves with little irritation. I also have a very thick beard. I figured my case is probably due to evolving technique, but YMMV.

I got a beautiful Merkur 180/23c and get BBS shaves but the burn is always there. My beard grows in several different directions both jaws straight down, chin left side left, right side right, middle chin down, neck left grows left, Adams apple left, right neck right, it's just a pain in the rear to shave.Angry

I see guys on YouTube shave with no obstructions like big protruding Adams apples and I'm envious.Confused

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 11-20-2012, 02:03 PM
#7
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An OC allows more lather through to lubricate what needs to be lubricated, and cushion what needs to be cushioned. It's that simple. The SE closed comb serves precisely the same function as an OC since the SE closed comb is a "closed comb" in name only.

As far as shave goes, the rest is just razor/blade geometry.

I explained this in detail in a thread somewhere on this forum, so I don't need to do it again.

Maybe someone knows where it's found?

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 11-20-2012, 05:03 PM
#8
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This thread is making me consider getting a Cadet...

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 11-21-2012, 08:34 AM
#9
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(11-20-2012, 05:03 PM)taborcarn Wrote: This thread is making me consider getting a Cadet ...

I recently got a Cadet TP-24 OC, my first OC. Bravo! Smile

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 11-21-2012, 09:18 AM
#10
  • DEW
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(11-21-2012, 08:34 AM)Michael G Wrote:
(11-20-2012, 05:03 PM)taborcarn Wrote: This thread is making me consider getting a Cadet ...

I recently got a Cadet TP-24 OC, my first OC. Bravo! Smile

Idea How does the Cadet shave, and is it as aggressive as the Fatip? I may add one to my collection..Shy

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 11-21-2012, 09:31 AM
#11
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(11-21-2012, 09:18 AM)DEW Wrote: Idea How does the Cadet shave, and is it as aggressive as the Fatip? I may add one to my collection..Shy

I have no comparison; the Cadet is my first OC. What I can tell you is that I'm into my 3rd year of DE shaving and so have experience in using minimal pressure, and no foolin'!

I used it carefully, gently. The difference in feel was immediate. But it wasn't scary. And it was keen and clean. A BBS shave right out of the gate.

I now own 3 Cadets. These are a bargain, I feel. Of course, time will tell, but right OOB they look to be well made and all 3 types -OC, safety bar, and TTO closed comb- are hefty and handsome products. Smile

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 11-21-2012, 09:48 AM
#12
  • DEW
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(11-21-2012, 09:31 AM)Michael G Wrote:
(11-21-2012, 09:18 AM)DEW Wrote: Idea How does the Cadet shave, and is it as aggressive as the Fatip? I may add one to my collection..Shy

I have no comparison; the Cadet is my first OC. What I can tell you is that I'm into my 3rd year of DE shaving and so have experience in using minimal pressure, and no foolin'!

I used it carefully, gently. The difference in feel was immediate. But it wasn't scary. And it was keen and clean. A BBS shave right out of the gate.

I now own 3 Cadets. These are a bargain, I feel. Of course, time will tell, but right OOB they look to be well made and all 3 types -OC, safety bar, and TTO closed comb- are hefty and handsome products. Smile

Thanks, I can feel the blade on the Fatip, that I like and have never felt intimidated by it, just a nice clean shave! I'll be getting a Cadet soon. Wink

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 11-21-2012, 09:53 AM
#13
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(11-21-2012, 09:48 AM)DEW Wrote: Thanks, I can feel the blade on the Fatip, that I like and have never felt intimidated by it, just a nice clean shave! I'll be getting a Cadet soon. Wink

Use it only in good health! You're bound to enjoy it! Smile

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 11-21-2012, 06:54 PM
#14
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(11-21-2012, 09:18 AM)DEW Wrote:
(11-21-2012, 08:34 AM)Michael G Wrote:
(11-20-2012, 05:03 PM)taborcarn Wrote: This thread is making me consider getting a Cadet ...

I recently got a Cadet TP-24 OC, my first OC. Bravo! Smile

Idea How does the Cadet shave, and is it as aggressive as the Fatip? I may add one to my collection..Shy

I think the Fatip and Cadet are very similar in shaving characteristics. Aggressively smoooooth.

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 11-21-2012, 07:38 PM
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(11-21-2012, 06:54 PM)CyanideMetal Wrote: I think the Fatip and Cadet are very similar in shaving characteristics. Aggressively smoooooth.

And where the rubber meets the road, I'll agree. Good description.

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 11-21-2012, 08:34 PM
#16
  • A28
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interesting

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 11-21-2012, 08:38 PM
#17
  • Samjax
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I've had both - the Fatip and the Cadet...along with the Joris, Big Fellow Old, NEW, etc...

The Fatip and Cadet are very close - I would probably say the Fatip is ever so slightly more aggressive - but you would be very hard pressed to tell the difference. It offers and amazing shave for the money.

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 11-22-2012, 01:27 PM
#18
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(11-20-2012, 02:03 PM)ShadowsDad Wrote: An OC allows more lather through to lubricate what needs to be lubricated, and cushion what needs to be cushioned. It's that simple. The SE closed comb serves precisely the same function as an OC since the SE closed comb is a "closed comb" in name only.

As far as shave goes, the rest is just razor/blade geometry.

I explained this in detail in a thread somewhere on this forum, so I don't need to do it again.

Maybe someone knows where it's found?

I remember that,good stuff.
http://shavenook.com/thread-lets-see-tho...pid106582a

ShadowsDad:
Long before anyone conceived of BOTOC SE users knew of it. We just don't use the same terminology. It's actually humorous if you think about it. Sure our open comb razors are efficient, but our closed comb razors wipe the floor with most open comb DE razors. But continue reading.

But it isn't as simple as just "Open comb" IMO. If you look in the archives you'll see some reviews I did with some of the obvious 1912 "family" and 4 Valet models. Check out where I show blade geometry. But the point I'm trying to make is that an open comb is just a comb, the rest is blade geometry. Understand, I like an open comb or a SE closed comb not because of any percieved benefit other than IMO it allows more lather through to where it should be... at the skin/blade interface. I also use SE safety bar razors (now that's a closed comb! See the Featherweight and ClogPruf MM) and closed comb in DE.

BTW, in DE it's still blade geometry at work that makes a razor aggressive or not. The comb is just a comb that controls where the blade is in relation to the skin (geometry) and lets through lather to do it's job. It's not magic or esoteric knowledge. It's just a comb type.

Now here's a question for you to ponder... Why did razor designers put safety bar (SE) and closed comb (DE) on their mild razors? More lube means a better shave and folks use mild razors because they want the benefits of less blade contact, etc., which more lube provides. It seems common sense to me to not handicap mild razors with a comb that sweeps the lube away, but to explain that the razor is mild, aggressive, whatever, and put the more efficient open comb on all DE or the closed/open comb on all SE razors. But what do I know? I just use them. Maybe the punch die was less expensive for the safety bar (SE) or closed comb (DE) razors. But it seems to me they'd want to make the beginners razor w/o handicaps designed into it. I bet unless someone finds notes from the designers, that we'll never know the answer to that. But to me it goes counter to what I would design.

Does that make sense?

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 11-24-2012, 04:23 AM
#19
  • DaveL
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DEW,

Glad to hear that you're enjoying your New Standard. Those are fine shaving machines.

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 11-24-2012, 08:03 AM
#20
  • DEW
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(11-21-2012, 06:54 PM)CyanideMetal Wrote:
(11-21-2012, 09:18 AM)DEW Wrote:
(11-21-2012, 08:34 AM)Michael G Wrote: I recently got a Cadet TP-24 OC, my first OC. Bravo! Smile

Idea How does the Cadet shave, and is it as aggressive as the Fatip? I may add one to my collection..Shy

I think the Fatip and Cadet are very similar in shaving characteristics. Aggressively smoooooth.

Great, I'll get one then, I have a RazoRock Jaws on the way and am excited about trying it. I don't know exactly why but the Open Comb razors leave me with BBS shaves and NO IRRITATION as with bar types, go figure.

(11-24-2012, 04:23 AM)DaveL Wrote: DEW,

Glad to hear that you're enjoying your New Standard. Those are fine shaving machines.

Yes, thanks Dave, that new is a fine razor. I was planing on having it re-plated but now I've seen it I changed my mind, maybe later but it looks fine. Thanks for the razor, I'm pleased..

(11-21-2012, 09:53 AM)Michael G Wrote:
(11-21-2012, 09:48 AM)DEW Wrote: Thanks, I can feel the blade on the Fatip, that I like and have never felt intimidated by it, just a nice clean shave! I'll be getting a Cadet soon. Wink

Use it only in good health! You're bound to enjoy it! Smile

Thanks, I will.

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