01-23-2013, 11:08 PM
#1
User Info
Based on what I read, AOS has not only reformulated their shaving cream, but their shaving soap as well. It is no longer tallow-based and made in Italy, but palm oil based and USA sourced. Users should stock-up before old stock is depleted.

Do all the quality cream and soap makers have to make a mad dash to mediocrity? I worry that DR Harris will be the next soap maker to make a winner into a loser.

Unbelievable!

Michael

24 276
Reply
 01-23-2013, 11:16 PM
#2
  • tgutc
  • Senior Member
  • Michigan
User Info
Why do they all insist on doing that. I have yet to try an AOS soap and I hope I get to before the tallow versions are all gone.

45 3,955
Reply
 01-23-2013, 11:18 PM
#3
User Info
Answer is simple...

Valobra wants huge money... Gillette was huge margins...

it's like mixing oil and water!

I figured it was only a matter of time before Gillette dumped Valobra.

3 315
Reply
 01-23-2013, 11:18 PM
#4
  • KLF
  • Member
  • Israel
User Info
Well AOS is owned by P&G now, what else do you expect ?

0 55
Reply
 01-23-2013, 11:55 PM
#5
  • Teiste
  • Moderator Emeritus
  • Salt Lake City,UT
User Info
Yeah , this was something that many experienced members of shaving boards were expecting from a long time ago (2009 , basically).Well , I dont know how its the new Palm based version , but the fact that is Made in USA , doesn't give me any "security" about getting one.The other non artisan shaving soap made in USA that I have tried , is C&M , and we all know how terrible are those soaps...

86 7,123
Reply
 01-24-2013, 03:15 AM
#6
User Info
I honestly can't stand AoS, nor the arrogant jerks that work the places either, I could care if P&G ran it into the ground; oh wait...

0 652
Reply
 01-24-2013, 04:15 AM
#7
User Info
tHis is sad news... AoS/valobra were some of the best soaps on the market. It's sad to see this happen.Sad

(01-23-2013, 11:55 PM)Teiste Wrote: Yeah , this was something that many experienced members of shaving boards were expecting from a long time ago (2009 , basically).Well , I dont know how its the new Palm based version , but the fact that is Made in USA , doesn't give me any "security" about getting one.The other non artisan shaving soap made in USA that I have tried , is C&M , and we all know how terrible are those soaps...

Don't forget Williams, VdH and Col. Conk...
Oh, wait... they're not that good, also Laughing1

2 5,527
Reply
 01-24-2013, 04:31 AM
#8
User Info
I too thought that P&G would drop Valobra sooner or later, and this is actually later than I expected. But it occurred to me that once Valobra was out of the AoS contract, they could begin to market the soaps under their own label, probably for less money.

So I hope, anyway.

--Glenn

1 49
Reply
 01-24-2013, 04:34 AM
#9
User Info
What is the source for this?

2 697
Reply
 01-24-2013, 04:46 AM
#10
User Info
(01-24-2013, 03:15 AM)Sodapopjones Wrote: I honestly can't stand AoS, nor the arrogant jerks that work the places either, I could care if P&G ran it into the ground; oh wait...

On a visceral level, I certainly empathize with your sentiments. Nevertheless, I profoundly disagree. I believe the loss or diminishment of AoS would have a broad detrimental effect both on our hobby and beloved smaller vendors.

The AoS is the only mass-market and highly visible commercial enterprise that caters to the wet shaving audience. In fact, AoS products are often our gateway into wet shaving, either through a gift from a loved one or simple curiosity as we meandered through the mall (or in my case, Grand Central Station in NYC). Many of us were never exposed to DE or straight razors or using a brush, and would never have considered such "old fashioned" and "Luddite" thinking without the lure of strong name brand and easy access stores. This increased audience and vastly larger number of curious and enthusiastic wet shavers also support smaller vendors and manufacturers. I started wet shaving around 2008, and in that short amount of time the number of new products and retailers have vastly increased due in no small part to the marketing acumen of AoS and financial capital of P&G. Small hobbies supported by even smaller vendors are not always in an adversarial relationship with big companies like P&G. In our case, I think the relationship is symbiotic. The AoS brings in and encourages new wet shavers that support our interests overall.

Lastly, although I acknowledge that their hardware is gimmicky and way overpriced, AoS creams and soaps, although costly, have been superb. The reformulation of the soap might not even be as bad as our panic may dictate. Tallow is not magic. If it was, MdC, TFS, Proraso and other companies would not have the incredible reputations they now enjoy. I am also entirely aware of loss of quality soaps from companies such as GFT after their dreaded reformulation. I remain cautiously optimistic, and eagerly await review of the new formula soap.

0 386
Reply
 01-24-2013, 05:22 AM
#11
User Info
(01-24-2013, 04:46 AM)branford Wrote:
(01-24-2013, 03:15 AM)Sodapopjones Wrote: I honestly can't stand AoS, nor the arrogant jerks that work the places either, I could care if P&G ran it into the ground; oh wait...

On a visceral level, I certainly empathize with your sentiments. Nevertheless, I profoundly disagree. I believe the loss or diminishment of AoS would have a broad detrimental effect both on our hobby and beloved smaller vendors.

The AoS is the only mass-market and highly visible commercial enterprise that caters to the wet shaving audience. In fact, AoS products are often our gateway into wet shaving, either through a gift from a loved one or simple curiosity as we meandered through the mall (or in my case, Grand Central Station in NYC). Many of us were never exposed to DE or straight razors or using a brush, and would never have considered such "old fashioned" and "Luddite" thinking without the lure of strong name brand and easy access stores. This increased audience and vastly larger number of curious and enthusiastic wet shavers also support smaller vendors and manufacturers. I started wet shaving around 2008, and in that short amount of time the number of new products and retailers have vastly increased due in no small part to the marketing acumen of AoS and financial capital of P&G. Small hobbies supported by even smaller vendors are not always in an adversarial relationship with big companies like P&G. In our case, I think the relationship is symbiotic. The AoS brings in and encourages new wet shavers that support our interests overall.

Lastly, although I acknowledge that their hardware is gimmicky and way overpriced, AoS creams and soaps, although costly, have been superb. The reformulation of the soap might not even be as bad as our panic may dictate. Tallow is not magic. If it was, MdC, TFS, Proraso and other companies would not have the incredible reputations they now enjoy. I am also entirely aware of loss of quality soaps from companies such as GFT after their dreaded reformulation. I remain cautiously optimistic, and eagerly await review of the new formula soap.

The resurgence of wet-shaving in the United States had nothing to do with AoS, C&E, The Body Shop, or L'Occitane for that matter. The original members of SMF that branched out and formed other forums can be thanked in most part for creating what we have today, and not P&G.

As you can see, nothing AoS had to do with it...





Lastly touching on the reformulated soap, if the T's reformulations weren't as good as the original, AoS's is just going to suck period.

0 652
Reply
 01-24-2013, 05:30 AM
#12
User Info
(01-24-2013, 04:34 AM)SteelTown Wrote: What is the source for this?

Here:
http://badgerandblade.com/vb/showthread....ow-formula

2 5,527
Reply
 01-24-2013, 10:57 AM
#13
User Info
(01-23-2013, 11:08 PM)monarch2001 Wrote: Based on what I read, AOS has not only reformulated their shaving cream, but their shaving soap as well. It is no longer tallow-based and made in Italy, but palm oil based and USA sourced. Users should stock-up before old stock is depleted.

Do all the quality cream and soap makers have to make a mad dash to mediocrity? I worry that DR Harris will be the next soap maker to make a winner into a loser.

Unbelievable!

Michael

When I spoke to Harris last June regarding the ingredients of the then pending new Windsor soap, I was told they were very aware of the demise of other UK soaps following reformulation, and that they had no intention, whatsoever, of following suit. Never say never but I am not worried about any Harris reformulation away from tallow for the foreseeable future.

31 4,957
Reply
 01-24-2013, 11:10 AM
#14
User Info
(01-24-2013, 05:22 AM)Sodapopjones Wrote: The resurgence of wet-shaving in the United States had nothing to do with AoS, C&E, The Body Shop, or L'Occitane for that matter. The original members of SMF that branched out and formed other forums can be thanked in most part for creating what we have today, and not P&G.

As you can see, nothing AoS had to do with it...

You seem very angry about this. To say they had "nothing" to do with the resurgence despite the numerous posts from people on shaving forums to the contrary makes it seem like you just have an agenda.

5 78
Reply
 01-24-2013, 01:53 PM
#15
User Info
(01-23-2013, 11:18 PM)RazoRock_Joe Wrote: Answer is simple...

Valobra wants huge money... Gillette was huge margins...

it's like mixing oil and water!

I figured it was only a matter of time before Gillette dumped Valobra.

Given your connections to Italy, Joe, do you think this may hurt Valobra? I presume they were making a fair amount of soap for AoS (or P&G), and I would presume they were selling more of those pucks than shave sticks or their other products...at least outside of Italy. As Glenn mentioned, maybe this will allow Valobra to bring their tallow pucks to the market under their own name [EDIT] or RazoRock? What are the chances of you getting some info from your Italian connections? Biggrin

51 387
Reply
 01-24-2013, 02:36 PM
#16
  • JaDo
  • Member
  • Dallas, TX
User Info
Yes, "enquiring" minds want to know? Cool

6 235
Reply
 01-24-2013, 03:11 PM
#17
User Info
(01-24-2013, 11:10 AM)TallyShave Wrote:
(01-24-2013, 05:22 AM)Sodapopjones Wrote: The resurgence of wet-shaving in the United States had nothing to do with AoS, C&E, The Body Shop, or L'Occitane for that matter. The original members of SMF that branched out and formed other forums can be thanked in most part for creating what we have today, and not P&G.

As you can see, nothing AoS had to do with it...

You seem very angry about this. To say they had "nothing" to do with the resurgence despite the numerous posts from people on shaving forums to the contrary makes it seem like you just have an agenda.

If it wasn't British they weren't using it, well so Gordon would like you to believe haha.

Just watch Corey's video from 2006, when this all started basically.

0 652
Reply
 01-24-2013, 03:27 PM
#18
User Info
I got started in 07 after reading an article about shaving problems. I found SMF and the rest is history! Thanks God for that article and these forums.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

5 413
Reply
 01-24-2013, 06:47 PM
#19
  • GreekGuy
  • Not saving money yet....
  • La Jolla, CA
User Info
Gentlemen,

After hearing the reformulation rumors and evidence I paid a visit to my local AOS this afternoon.

I was greeted by the usual friendly but eager sales staff. I explained to the gentleman "assisting" me the differences between the old formulation and the new one. Mainly, that the old one was a beef fat base made by Valobra in Genoa Italy, and the new one was made using a Palm Oil base here by P&C. After that, it was evident that I knew a thing or two, and the purpose of my visit could be explained.

I should have known the warning signs, as my local store had been out of the Sandalwood soap for months. As I perused their inventory, I found that indeed, the sandalwood soap displays the same label as the one in the OP. There are also few minor packaging changes, noticeably that the font on the bottom of the front is larger, so the 95g / 3.3 Oz is larger and much more easily visible, unlike the tiny writing on the older package.

I told the sales rep that I would like to try the soap. He seemed thoroughly confused about my request. I do not know if this is standard procedure or due to my impressing him with knowing more about the soap than he did, but he told me that if I wanted to buy a puck, and I wasn't pleased with it, I could return it within 30 days. Something to take note of gentlemen. At this point, things were off to a good start.

Eventually he decided to let me try the soap. I gently soaked their "fine" badger brush under running water, and went to lather it up. The brush was a bit more wet than I would have liked, resulting in the usual foamy suds when I began lathering, as I've noticed many times with the DRH soaps. As I continued to load the brush, a very thick lather began to form. I felt it on my hand, and rubbed it between my fingers. The scent seemed unchanged, although that "tallow" smell tallow fans and vintage soap users all recognize is obviously gone. Despite using a ruddy brush, the soap seemed to make a lather with very little effort. I can't believe I'm about to write this, but if anything, it seemed a little softer than the old soap, and easier to lather.

When I first heard the news about the reformulation, I was devastated. But much to my amazement, the soap was outstanding. I do not know if P&G actually did some research for this soap, but based on my initial impressions, it is not the CM-esque soap I was fearing.

Based on this experiment, I feel comfortable enough taking one for the team and buy a puck this weekend to test out. Granted, I didn't shave with it, but I was quite pleased with what I found. And as some of you who read my reviews may be aware, I am not easily pleased.

I expect to go back either tomorrow or saturday. I will, of course, take photos of the packaging and lather.

I should also note that my local store had ample stock of the unscented, lavender, and lemon formulations, so if you want to stock up there may very well still be time to do so. That being said, I'm not sure in this instance if you really need to.

9 541
Reply
 01-24-2013, 06:58 PM
#20
  • Sully
  • Moderator Emeritus
  • Cedar Park, Texas
User Info
(01-24-2013, 04:31 AM)2clfrwrds Wrote: I too thought that P&G would drop Valobra sooner or later, and this is actually later than I expected. But it occurred to me that once Valobra was out of the AoS contract, they could begin to market the soaps under their own label, probably for less money.

So I hope, anyway.

--Glenn

Same here. I would really like to get Valobra stick, in puck form for less money than AOS was charging.

7 1,018
Reply
Users browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)